PSA: Never buying a (Toyota) nav system again?

[braumeister]

I like the backup camera more than I thought I would, plus it gives a display for the trip computer and an index to my music on my USB stub drive I have buried so it's not all bad.

+1
I sometimes use on-street parking where you have to back in to the space, diagonal to the curb. That rear-facing camera makes it a snap, and I get it perfectly the first time.

 

[MRG]

+1
I sometimes use on-street parking where you have to back in to the space, diagonal to the curb. That rear-facing camera makes it a snap, and I get it perfectly the first time.

I had a rental with one(backup camera) and loved it. Think I'm going to add an after market to my 2005 Silverado.

Factory GPS not for me.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Early Retirement Forum mobile app

 

[NW-Bound]

I find it bothersome and alarming that modern consumer electronics have a lot shorter life, i.e. working hours before failure, than they used to do. Why is it so? Solid state devices should last a lot more than a few years, if not forever. For a while, there was a rash of computer and TV failures due to bad electrolytic capacitors made by a "low-cost" Taiwanese maker. But I think there are now more failures of the semiconductor devices or chips.

I suspect that the chip manufacturing process has been slipping in quality. We tend to treat electronic devices now as disposable. People upgrade and throw away cell phones every two or three years, so manufacturers may just ask themselves why bother to make something last 10 or 20 years. But when the same short-life devices get into something that should last a long time like a big fancy TV or a car, that disposable mentality causes a lot of aggravation and waste.

 

[travelover]

The larger issue is that electronic devices have a useful life of a few years due to constant technology advances and cars have a useful life of decades due to quality and durability improvements. So, permanent installation of electronics is problematic if it can't be swapped out cleanly.

 

[Texas Proud]

Another problem with GPS (this being a Garmin) is that there can be some major errors with the map...

I have had 3 times where I put in an address correctly... and when I get to my destination.... I am NOT where I need to be...

One time it was off almost 3 miles... another time we were looking for a hotel... drove up and down the street looking for it.. finally drove next to a McDonalds and looked it up on Google... it was just over 2 miles off... we just had not driven down the road far enough to find it...

The last one is our house... not as bad, but it thinks we live about 6 or so houses down the road...

 

[ERD50]

I find it bothersome and alarming that modern consumer electronics have a lot shorter life, i.e. working hours before failure, than they used to do. Why is it so? Solid state devices should last a lot more than a few years, if not forever. For a while, there was a rash of computer and TV failures due to bad electrolytic capacitors made by a "low-cost" Taiwanese maker. But I think there are now more failures of the semiconductor devices or chips.

I suspect that the chip manufacturing process has been slipping in quality. We tend to treat electronic devices now as disposable. People upgrade and throw away cell phones every two or three years, so manufacturers may just ask themselves why bother to make something last 10 or 20 years. But when the same short-life devices get into something that should last a long time like a big fancy TV or a car, that disposable mentality causes a lot of aggravation and waste.

Agree that many things don't last as long as they should. I'm not sure it is the chips, I suspect buttons and connections, etc. And the fact that many electronics are upgraded faster than in the past, does lead to manufacturers not needing to build them to last either.

But I'd like to see at least some electronics be made more modular than they are. An on-board navigation system should just pop in/out with a single USB connection for power and data. You should be able to upgrade it in an 8 YO car for $150 or so.

-ERD50

 

[FUEGO]

We just got back from a road trip to Canada. No cell service while in the country, so we used google maps with downloaded map sets of the areas we visited. The data is surprisingly compact. 5 to 15 MB for the metro area of an entire city like Montreal or Quebec City. This was my back up for US cities as well in case I exceeded my data limit, had to turn of 3G data due to battery issues (this happened a lot!), or skyscrapers blocked the cell signal. It came in very handy.

I also used Sygic GPS which allows you to download map backs for anywhere in the world (although file sizes on some international map packs looked small, therefore I assume only major roads were included ??). The free version of Sygic is so-so as a navigation tool, but better than a paper map due to real time dynamic rerouting (if you miss a turn or detour due to construction which happened often in Montreal).

 

[bld999]

"My newest car is a 2000 and I've lost my electronic tachometer already. Since it's an automatic, a tach is just a toy, but I do miss it. I rarely hear or feel the car shift, so it's nice to watch it happen on the tach. I checked to see if the unit could be fixed and my mechanic started rubbing his whiskered chin. When he does that, I know it's going to be expensive. Needless to say, my tach is still broken."

Buy yourself an elm327 obd reader, about 20$, then download the app; "obd car doctor" [free] and dock the phone or tablet in view and you have a tach plus fuel consumption, battery voltage, yada yada.
Auto ecus are capable of reporting all kinds of data, not all of it displayed in vehicles.

What year will the average smartphone exceed the first Cray computer in power?

 

[misanman]

We had the built in nav on our 2012 but ditched it when we bought a 2014. We much prefer Google maps and very seldom have run into coverage problems with Verizon. I wish we could "host" our phone display on the vehicle screen, though.

 

[Midpack]

What year will the average smartphone exceed the first Cray computer in power?

Already has it appears
A modern smartphone or a vintage supercomputer: which is more powerful?

Several years later, in 1975, a supercomputer named Cray-1 came around. It was a capable and awesome-looking piece of machinery that "flew" at a rate of 80MHz. While generally used for scientific projects, such as simulating the interaction of fluids, one of these bad boys helped render the CGI for the first Tron movie, released in 1982. But a Cray-1's raw computational power of 80 million floating-point operations per second (FLOPS) is laughable by today's standards; the graphics unit inside the iPhone 5s produces about 76.8 GFLOPS – nearly a thousand times more. And surely, the iPhone can render 3D graphics looking better than Tron's Lightcycle scene. On a related note, the Cray-2 supercomputer was released 10 years after the Cray-1 and was the world's fastest supercomputer until 1990. But even with a performance of up to 1.9 GFLOPS, the liquid-cooled, 200-kilowatt machine still ranks behind the Apple iPhone, at least when it comes to GFLOPS ratings.

 

[ls99]

Another problem with GPS (this being a Garmin) is that there can be some major errors with the map...

I have had 3 times where I put in an address correctly... and when I get to my destination.... I am NOT where I need to be...

One time it was off almost 3 miles... another time we were looking for a hotel... drove up and down the street looking for it.. finally drove next to a McDonalds and looked it up on Google... it was just over 2 miles off... we just had not driven down the road far enough to find it...

The last one is our house... not as bad, but it thinks we live about 6 or so houses down the road...

I do use a used Garmin. Never trust it fully. Have paper maps, and do use them for frequent reality checks. Also print out Mapquest maps of destinations. Avoid Google like the plague. Do have laptop based maps as well. Belts and suspenders?

 

[aja8888]

Another problem with GPS (this being a Garmin) is that there can be some major errors with the map...

I have had 3 times where I put in an address correctly... and when I get to my destination.... I am NOT where I need to be...

One time it was off almost 3 miles... another time we were looking for a hotel... drove up and down the street looking for it.. finally drove next to a McDonalds and looked it up on Google... it was just over 2 miles off... we just had not driven down the road far enough to find it...

The last one is our house... not as bad, but it thinks we live about 6 or so houses down the road...

Try resetting your home point. That may fix the calibration which seems like it's off a bit. Also, update your points of interest or a map refresh.

It's worth a try. My Garmin is spot on all the time, but I tend to use coordinates more than streets.

 

[Sesq]

My wife and I argued about spending the coin on NAV in her highlander. She disliked the wires from the garmin. At the end of the day, her car, her choice, but it will be salt in the wound if it breaks based on those prices.

Net result is I got upgraded to her old garmin, which had speed limits, which my earlier one didn't have. Happy enough.

 

[aja8888]

Look, only one little wire:

 

[Texas Proud]

Try resetting your home point. That may fix the calibration which seems like it's off a bit. Also, update your points of interest or a map refresh.

It's worth a try. My Garmin is spot on all the time, but I tend to use coordinates more than streets.

My home point is spot on... I set it in the driveway... however, if I just put in my address like someone wanting to come to our house it shows 6 houses away...

 

[steelyman]

My home point is spot on... I set it in the driveway... however, if I just put in my address like someone wanting to come to our house it shows 6 houses away...

Maybe you've been going to the wrong house all this time? (joke!)

 

[athena53]

I really prefer to bring in my own technology. Sometimes I wish I could buy the equivalent of the old VW Beetle (well, it would have to have A/C and automatic transmission). Instead, everything is controlled by computers, all you get is a "check engine" light when something is wrong (or maybe it isn't) and half the time the mechanics can't figure it out and tell you it must be the computer. Our last Subaru had THREE catalytic converters. We know that because one went bad, we still had the problem, and the second one needed to be replaced. It's made the price of cars rise to ridiculous levels and made most repairs extremely expensive.

A few years ago, after replacing a microwave that was part of a microwave/oven unit (meaning I had to replace the oven, too), I learned my lesson about built-ins. We replaced it with an oven, a shelf above the oven and a free-standing microwave. The microwave died a month ago and it was a minor inconvenience.

I feel the same way about built-ins in cars. Too bad anything you buy off the lot (and, consequently, any car you buy used) is loaded to the gills with options.

 

[aja8888]

My home point is spot on... I set it in the driveway... however, if I just put in my address like someone wanting to come to our house it shows 6 houses away...

Kind of weird. What I would do is try to get a map update for the Garmin and then find your house on Google Earth and write down the Lat and Log. Then try to set your home point using the coordinates from Google Earth. It's worth a shot.

If it doesn't work, maybe e-mail Garmin and see what they say.

 

[braumeister]

My home point is spot on... I set it in the driveway... however, if I just put in my address like someone wanting to come to our house it shows 6 houses away...

That's a database issue, not a GPS problem.
There are only 2 or 3 geographical database providers used by the big GPS makers, and the one used by your gadget (probably NAVTEQ) has the addresses wrong on your street.

I had the same issue, with my house being shown as three houses away (Google had it wrong, too).

I sent in a correction (can't remember the details, it was at least 6 or 7 years ago), and it was corrected in an update about a year later.

 

[bUU]

For those who don't like video screens:

The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration issued a proposed rule Monday requiring all new light vehicles — including cars, SUVs, trucks and vans — to have "rear-view visibility systems," in effect, requiring backup cameras.

NHTSA to require backup cameras on all vehicles

 

[aja8888]

For those who don't like video screens:

NHTSA to require backup cameras on all vehicles

When we bought our 2013 Hyundai Santa Fe, option "three"was the tech package with large screen NAV, BU camera, etc. for $4,000 more. We declined and got option "two" which was a smaller screen (maybe 4" x 6") with a BU camera. Considerably less expensive and with the camera.

DW loves it, but still managed to back into my car in the driveway (phone use .)

Bottom line, at least Hyundai had a small screen option.

 

[Midpack]

I've had my car (the OP is DW's car) for over two years and it came with a backup camera. I never look at the screen, I'd rather turn around and look. And the beep is annoying. I guess I'm a full fledged curmudgeon. YMMV

And get off my lawn...

 

[springnr]

My newest car is a 2000 and I've lost my electronic tachometer already. Since it's an automatic, a tach is just a toy, but I do miss it. I rarely hear or feel the car shift, so it's nice to watch it happen on the tach. I checked to see if the unit could be fixed and my mechanic started rubbing his whiskered chin. When he does that, I know it's going to be expensive. Needless to say, my tach is still broken.
>

As mentioned OBD II to iPhone apps can provide tach function.
Also choices like scan gauge or ultra gauge

UltraGauge OBDII Scan tool & Information Center

https://www.google.com/search?q=obdii+display+speed&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&client=firefox-a&channel=sb#channel=sb&q=obdii+display+gauge&rls=org.mozilla:en-USfficial&safe=of

 

[Car-Guy]

I really like my newest built-in NAV system (2014 Toyota Sequoia). My only other vehicle with a built-in NAV is a C6 Corvette. I often will use a portable Garmin when I'm driving my other cars. Since I travel the "back roads" of the US a good bit, I find them very useful. I've found the NAV system in the Corvette doesn't always pick the best route or even present all reasonable routes. Sometimes it will tell me to make a turn where there is no road.. However, the Toyota NAV system has been flawless, so far. And I find the backup camera very useful.

 

[explanade]

Sad part is, I was just reading about how garmin type gps units are becoming obsolete. Sales have steadily declined despite rapidly falling prices. People are just using there smart phones. I know it is true for us. We have a garmin unit in each vehicle, and they just sit in the glove box. I now just use google maps on my iphone. I have a mount for it on my dash. The google maps totes and reroutes much faster. The estimated time of arrival is always spot on and factors on traffic. The traffic times seem much more instantaneous. Plus nothing to update, as it gets it's info from the Internet. I like how quick and easy it is to look up points of interest compared to a stand alone gps. These new phones are amazingly powerful and fast computers. Now I could see instances that a portable unit might have an advantage, such as poor cellular service, but my phone is my go to device now.

I agree that I would like to see some way to just display and control my phone in my vehicle. To have some kind of integration of an already owned device with already paid for cellular data would be great. Unfortunately when it does happen, someone else will want an additional monthly fee I am sure.

Google and Apple are both working with car makers to have their devices supported on the center screen in cars.

That and support for things like steering wheel mounted controls.

Again there is supposedly some kind of law, maybe it's a state law, to have all cars equipped with rear cameras by like 2018 or so. In that case, all cars would have some kind of screens.