PSA: Never buying a (Toyota) nav system again?

[steelyman]

Google and Apple are both working with car makers to have their devices supported on the center screen in cars.



That and support for things like steering wheel mounted controls.



Again there is supposedly some kind of law, maybe it's a state law, to have all cars equipped with rear cameras by like 2018 or so. In that case, all cars would have some kind of screens.

I don't know when I will buy my next car, but a rear camera would be nice. There are a lot of kids who run around and bike here, which I enjoy as I think they add "spirit", and anything that helps not running into something is welcome to me. I helped a kid today who was "stuck" in my driveway on his bike (the chain had popped off) and he was happy and so was I.

 

[REWahoo]

I don't know when I will buy my next car, but a rear camera would be nice.

Won't be long until you won't be able to buy a new car without one...

U.S. finalizes plan to phase in rearview camera mandate, starting in 2016

 

[Gumby]

Won't be long until you won't be able to buy a new car without one...

U.S. finalizes plan to phase in rearview camera mandate, starting in 2016

I'm thinking that my next 'car' will be a 1948-52 Ford F-1 pickup, so I'm probably safe.

 

[RunningBum]

I've had my car (the OP is DW's car) for over two years and it came with a backup camera. I never look at the screen, I'd rather turn around and look. And the beep is annoying. I guess I'm a full fledged curmudgeon. YMMV

And get off my lawn...

What beep? That's unrelated to a backup camera, at least on most cars.

 

[athena53]

Won't be long until you won't be able to buy a new car without one...

U.S. finalizes plan to phase in rearview camera mandate, starting in 2016

Yeah, I know the woman behind the organization who advocated for this. She started with getting regulations enacted to put manual trunk releases in every car, so someone who was locked into the trunk could get out safely. (Someone had ambushed them at their home and locked them in the trunk of their car.) Cheap prevention- that was fine. Then she started on the backup cameras. I had one on a rented car and found it a distraction. I don't WANT one and now I have to have one if I buy a car built after 2015.

Fair warning: now she's starting on some sort of alarm for kids left in car seats in the back seat of the car and she's circulating a petition to get government funds to find a possible solution. Dammit, if they hadn't already insisted that you hide your baby in the back seat, facing the back of the car, that wouldn't be necessary.

Yeah, get me a VW Beetle. The original version.

 

[eytonxav]

We recently bought a new Acura RDX without the tech package (NAV, power tailgate, HID headlights, and upgraded stereo). It didn't seem worth the extra cost for features that were not important to us and thought that if something breaks it will be expensive.

 

[W2R]

[...]it came with a backup camera. I never look at the screen, I'd rather turn around and look.

I do both. First I look in the mirrors, then I turn around and look, then I check the camera, then I turn around again and back up. I suppose the backup camera could conceivably show me something I couldn't otherwise detect. I do stretches at the gym which improve my flexibility so that I can turn all the way around like that very easily.

Hopefully other drivers do not rely exclusively on the backup camera, because I don't think it shows the driver nearly as much as turning around and looking directly. If they do rely on it too much, then it is more of a danger than a safety feature IMO.

 

[Midpack]

We recently bought a new Acura RDX without the tech package (NAV, power tailgate, HID headlights, and upgraded stereo). It didn't seem worth the extra cost for features that were not important to us and thought that if something breaks it will be expensive.

I agree. But when we opted for the nav upgrade for about $1500, I never dreamed it would cost $4400 to replace when it went out...too soon old, too late smart.

I guess we should be thankful (but we're not) we got 7 years out of it. I read about another owner on a Toyota forum who had his nav system die after he'd owned the Camry Hybrid for 40 months and 33K miles (out of warranty on months...)

We're not willing to settle for a clone unit or a blank insert, so we're in the midst of deciding between the various independent nav system rebuilders at about $500 to $1250. YMMV

 

[MichaelB]

I agree. But when we opted for the nav upgrade for about $1500, I never dreamed it would cost $4400 to replace when it went out...too soon old, too late smart.

I guess we should be thankful (but we're not) we got 7 years out of it. I read about another owner on a Toyota forum who had his nav system die after he'd owned the Camry Hybrid for 40 months and 33K miles (out of warranty on months...)

I think you're being too hard on yourself. The large in-dash screen is much more compelling than the small screen of a portable device, and advances in GPS technology do not make older devices obsolete.

The lesson here for me is not to bypass the built-in option, it's to make sure that there are marketplace alternatives for the option I choose in case replacement or repair is needed.

 

[explanade]

I agree. But when we opted for the nav upgrade for about $1500, I never dreamed it would cost $4400 to replace when it went out...too soon old, too late smart.

I guess we should be thankful (but we're not) we got 7 years out of it. I read about another owner on a Toyota forum who had his nav system die after he'd owned the Camry Hybrid for 40 months and 33K miles (out of warranty on months...)

We're not willing to settle for a clone unit or a blank insert, so we're in the midst of deciding between the various independent nav system rebuilders at about $500 to $1250. YMMV

I think your dealer is seeing how much you're willing to pay.

They tend to have a sliding price scale.

 

[Midpack]

I think your dealer is seeing how much you're willing to pay.

They tend to have a sliding price scale.

There are undoubtedly exceptions, but if you research online, you'll find the prices I've quoted have been very consistent from Toyota dealers all over the US. Many Toyota owners have been through this, and evidently rebuilding OEM nav systems (not just Toyota) has become a growing niche business.

 

[2B]

I bought a Garmin (with advice from here). It works great and I was able to drop it in a backpack when using a rental car (they wanted $11 a day for one of their GPS units!).

A number of years ago I wanted to go on a driving tour of Ireland. GPS units had been out awhile but I had never had one. Maps worked fine. I got concerned when I started hearing stories about people getting ost in Ireland. Rental cars wanted the equivalent of $15/day. I bought a new Garmin and a European map card and still came out ahead.

I've gotten so I don't think I could live without one now.

 

[braumeister]

Hopefully other drivers do not rely exclusively on the backup camera, because I don't think it shows the driver nearly as much as turning around and looking directly.

Much of the time, you're right. And for many of us, the camera is probably completely unnecessary.

But for parking in tight places, especially where you have to back in to the slot, it is an absolute godsend.

 

[Willers]

I just totaled my 2005, 150K mile sports sedan. The perfect car for me: a radio and crude trip computer. That's it. Not even an automatic transmission. Driving it was like...well...driving. I know I am definitely not the norm.

Looked at new cars. Everything has screens, cameras, 100 trip computer options, variable dash colors, drive by wire, on and on. Ended up with the minimum I could and still get something that remotely resembled something with a main purpose of spirited driving. I'm all for progress, but in 10 years these will seem like 70's shag carpets.

I'll take roll up windows and a manual clutch any day...

Yup, and get off my lawn too!

 

[Schutzie]

Since no one else stepped up, Gladys is from this (so bad it's good) TV series...

And we have a winner!!

 

[JoeWras]

I just totaled my 2005, 150K mile sports sedan. The perfect car for me: a radio and crude trip computer. That's it. Not even an automatic transmission. Driving it was like...well...driving. I know I am definitely not the norm.

Looked at new cars. Everything has screens, cameras, 100 trip computer options, variable dash colors, drive by wire, on and on. Ended up with the minimum I could and still get something that remotely resembled something with a main purpose of spirited driving. I'm all for progress, but in 10 years these will seem like 70's shag carpets.

I'll take roll up windows and a manual clutch any day...

Yup, and get off my lawn too!

You forgot the manual choke.

I know many Toyotas of the 70's had them. Borrowed my friend's car and couldn't start it. He asked if I choked it? I'm like: "What is this thing, a lawn mower?"

 

[MRG]

Much of the time, you're right. And for many of us, the camera is probably completely unnecessary.

But for parking in tight places, especially where you have to back in to the slot, it is an absolute godsend.

Yes I agree, I don't have a great range of motion despite exercise. I'm one that backs into parking places whenever it's feasible. Why, it's safer to back into a mostly non-moving area than to back out into passing traffic. It gives me an extra level of confidence I haven't missed something. You still have to look and use mirrors properly.

 

[Willers]

You forgot the manual choke.

I know many Toyotas of the 70's had them. Borrowed my friend's car and couldn't start it. He asked if I choked it? I'm like: "What is this thing, a lawn mower?"

Ah, yes. Had one of these in an old 60's Mustang I owned a few years ago. I tried to explain to my nephew how it worked and he looked at me like I was completely insane.

 

[Gumby]

Last car I had with a manual choke was a 1972 Triumph TR6.

 

[ls99]

Was watching a guy get ready to crank his XKE. One hand was pulling the choke, the other had crossed fingers, hoping the three SU carbs and Lucas would cooperate and the engine will start.

 

[Texas Proud]

I do both. First I look in the mirrors, then I turn around and look, then I check the camera, then I turn around again and back up. I suppose the backup camera could conceivably show me something I couldn't otherwise detect. I do stretches at the gym which improve my flexibility so that I can turn all the way around like that very easily.

Hopefully other drivers do not rely exclusively on the backup camera, because I don't think it shows the driver nearly as much as turning around and looking directly. If they do rely on it too much, then it is more of a danger than a safety feature IMO.

I was in a Caddy the other day and was looking at the guys back up camera.. it showed a good amount back there... he said that if something was coming from the side an arrow would appear on the screen showing which direction... SO, seems to be even better than turning around and looking... I (and you also) have blind spots due to the C pillar... you cannot always see everything...

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

I was in a Caddy the other day and was looking at the guys back up camera.. it showed a good amount back there... he said that if something was coming from the side an arrow would appear on the screen showing which direction... SO, seems to be even better than turning around and looking... I (and you also) have blind spots due to the C pillar... you cannot always see everything...

I can say I was skeptical about the backup camera but when I got my DWs hand me down Infiniti, well, I'm a believer now. When I'm parked with trucks on either side of me, the ONLY way to see traffic going down the aisle is WITH the camera. Before, it's just luck that no one hits me as I back out.

Also, the field of view is much wider than what I can see by turning around.

Sent from my mobile device so please excuse grammatical errors.

 

[bUU]

The backup camera is the best safety enhancement for motor vehicles since the safety belt. Beside how it helps keep little human beings who wander behind a vehicle backing-up safe, it also greatly reduces the risks to the vehicle associated backing into/out of anything. I'm an excellent back-upper and always have been. But the reality is that we drivers sit in the front row of the vehicle. Behind us is another row of seating, and a trunk, and that and the bars that hold up the roof the car will block some of the vision of anyone other than Clark Kent. The back-up camera has no blind spot in its field of vision. It makes you the Superman of backing up.

 

[prudent_one]

We got a aftermarket in-dash NAV system for our Buick, it was still pricey (about $1K). If it ever craps out, I'll put the factory radio back in and call it a day. The nav is handy but I agree with the observation that a smartphone can do it as well. I like having it but would not pay that again to replace it (and chances are when it does die, there won't be any compatible replacements still available anyway).

Tired of having everything turned into computers when the benefit is tiny and is tied to enormous repair costs and shorter lifespans. My friend has a Maytag high end washer - 2 years old - and the electronic control panel died. The panel can't be fixed, only replaced - $500.

 

[Katsmeow]

I am going to speak in favor of the OEM in dash navigation systems that I've had. Yes, I'm sure they can break after the car is out of warranty, but so can everything else. I've personally never had it happy in the cars where I've had in dash navigation.

I currently have it in my Ford Explorer. Periodically (at no charge) I get sent data cards with updated maps. The maps are not out of date and it works fine. I like the large screen and enjoy it being in the dash where it doesn't impede vision at all.

I don't want to use my smartphone while driving as my GPS. I don't want to have to find a mount for it and mount it. DH used his smartphone once in a car where we didn't have navigation and found that downloading maps used a lot of data and battery (GPS doesn't use data but downloading maps does).

If you don't use a map for the smartphone then I think it can be very distracting and dangerous to use.

In our Prius I decided not to give in dash navigation and bought a Garmin GPS and stuck it to the windshield. It was a very nice GPS unit. But, it was constantly falling off the windshield which is to say the least distracting while driving. Eventually I gave the Prius to my son and he finally junked the GPS since it wouldn't stay on the windshield. And he didn't like having something on the windshield.

You can get dashboard mounts which I think are preferable to windshield mount but not everyone wants something on the dashboard.

Edit: On the backup camera -- I totally agree with bUU. We are about to buy a vehicle for my daughter and I won't consider one that doesn't have a backup camera.

W2R you see way more with the backup camera than you do without it. I have backup cameras on several cars and it gives me a much greater field of vision.