Senator Craig: Guilty or Entrapped?

[TexasGal]

I was wondering the same thing, Martha. How?

Shimmy under into the next stall? Yuck! Filthy floors aside from what they are going to do. I had to do that once when my little granddaughter managed to get herself "locked in" and couldn't remember how to undo what she had just accomplished by fitting the lock together. I had a hard time slipping under the stall. How would a large man do it?

 

[TexasGal]

REWahoo, I said I was wondering . . . I guess I don't really want to know either.

TG

 

[brewer12345]

How would a large man do it?

Never understimate how motivated a sufficiently horny guy can be.

 

[lazygood4nothinbum]

i suppose there are no humping heterosexuals engaged in public sex on fort lauderdale beach at night. or in a car at your local mall. why aren't they getting arrested?

 

[greg]

As I've been watching this stuff . . . um . . . unfold on TV news, I keep getting that old Lay's potato chip slogan going thru my head: "Nobody can eat just one."

Seriously, I don't see this as a gay or homosexual thing. To call it that is insulting toward good gay folks. I sort of see him as a male nymphomaniac, a child with no will power, unable to get control over his basic impulses. It's even more disgusting that he is an old man with no control, probably a grandfather.



.........................what do women do in those circumstances?

 

[Leonidas]

This got more interest that I anticipated. I'll have to reply a little later when I have more time (I know, whadaya do all day?). I'm surprised that nobody picked up on this yet:

BlogActive: Real Truth, Direct Action

A blog outed Craig last October:

[FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]I have done extensive research into this case, including trips to the Pacific Northwest to meet with men who have say they have physical relations with the Senator. I have also met with a man here in Washington, D.C., who says the same -- and that these incidents occurred in the bathrooms of Union Station. None of these men know each other, or knew that I was talking to others. They all reported similar personal characteristics about the Senator, which lead me to believe, beyond any doubt, that their stories are valid.[/FONT]

i suppose there are no humping heterosexuals engaged in public sex on fort lauderdale beach at night. or in a car at your local mall. why aren't they getting arrested?

My post would have been a lot longer if I had tried to address all the things I was anticipating that might come up - but while writing I did wonder if you would respond and what you might say. I'll answer in a bit more detail later, but I'll just say that we were equal opportunity when it came to arresting offenders but we respond to complaints. We got plenty of complaints about heterosexual activity (prostitution, pornography, sex in clubs, etc) and arrested them the same as anyone else.

 

[lazygood4nothinbum]

you force gay men into closets with your constitutional amendments banning gay marriage and then you hunt them down once you've locked them behind your partitions.

this is shooting fish in a barrel and calling yourselves sportsmen.

 

[Caroline]

i suppose there are no humping heterosexuals engaged in public sex on fort lauderdale beach at night. or in a car at your local mall. why aren't they getting arrested?

I have my own questions about all this. Why are we spending tax dollars to go after these folks at all?

If they're right out in the open having sex where anyone (including children) can see them and lodge a complaint, then yes, arrest them.

But if you have to entrap them because they're in the stall together and nobody can see what's going on without peeking, then I'm not sure what harm they're doing?

IMHO, I'd rather have the police out fighting violent crime (including sex crimes such as rape), than hanging in the mens' room all night.

 

[SecondCor521]

I have another question but someone probably will have to answer me by pm or be a very careful writer. How do they have sex when one guy is in one stall and the other guy in another stall. Where does "it" go?

I think you mean "how?", not "where?"

I would have thought one guy would just go into the other guy's stall, but
according to [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]A roundup of questions about U.S. senators and sex in public bathrooms. - By Christopher Beam - Slate Magazine[/FONT] they also sometimes manage under the stall divider.

2Cor521

 

[maddythebeagle]

I think you mean "how?", not "where?"

they also sometimes manage under the stall divider.

2Cor521

Another reason to bring along one of these Machete - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia your next visit to the bathroom

Seriously, I dont have a problem with the police setting stings after getting complaints of lewd acts in a public restroom....

 

[Sandy]

Because of homophobia, we have two sets of men: those who admit they are gay and those who deny they are gay, but 9may) admit to having sex with men. It is sad that people fear the labels (with some justification) so much that they can't comfortably form the private adult relations that make them happy.

A bit off topic, but in the public health world, it is critical to direct separate messages to these two groups of men. Men who have sex with men (but don't classify themselves as gay), do not heed public health messages about safe sex, STDs, etc that are directed to gay men. So, they deny the risk and because they are often married or have serial relationships, they place their partners at risk as well.

 

[lazygood4nothinbum]

We got plenty of complaints about heterosexual activity (prostitution, pornography, sex in clubs, etc) and arrested them the same as anyone else.

so gays and str8s are treated the same? i suspect you didn't even buy that while you were typing it.

 

[lazygood4nothinbum]

A bit off topic, but in the public health world, it is critical to direct separate messages to these two groups of men. Men who have sex with men (but don't classify themselves as gay), do not heed public health messages about safe sex, STDs, etc that are directed to gay men. So, they deny the risk and because they are often married or have serial relationships, they place their partners at risk as well.

as opposed to the str8 guys who are screwing around with females but apparently immune from transmitting stds.

 

[travelover]

Maybe this explains why when I get off from a plane and head for the can, all the dang stalls are "in use". Gay or straight, get the heck out of there and let a guy do his business!

 

[Sandy]

as opposed to the str8 guys who are screwing around with females but apparently immune from transmitting stds.

True, but the difference is, when they hear messages directed at heterosexual activity, they acknowledge that those messages might actually apply to them. Whether they follow through is a whole 'nother thing entirely - As you said, "I am immune" "It won't happen to me" are likely responses. But that is different than " that doesn't apply to me". Subtle distinction yes, but for prevention and health promotion, the distinction results in different needed strategies/messages.

 

[TromboneAl]

Well, I guess I wouldn't be a good cop, since I can't help but think how it would feel for someone who truly did not intend anything, and simply let his feet slip, only to be arrested.

No way this would have ended up with a conviction if it had gone to court...smart lawyer would have cleaned up the mess in no time...problem is, Craig is guilty, knew he was guilty, was hoping to plead out to a lesser charge and then hope the story never came out. It did and he's done.

Or he was innocent, but realized that, because he was a senator, if it went to court he was screwed anyway, no matter what the outcome.

How do they have sex when one guy is in one stall and the other guy in another stall?

I don't see a problem here, or any need for shimmying. One of the guys just steps out of his stall and into the other's stall -- either when no one's around, or no one's paying attention.

 

[bright eyed]

I think you mean "how?", not "where?"

I would have thought one guy would just go into the other guy's stall, but
according to [FONT=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica]A roundup of questions about U.S. senators and sex in public bathrooms. - By Christopher Beam - Slate Magazine[/FONT] they also sometimes manage under the stall divider.

2Cor521

you know, i don't think a day goes by on this board where you don't learn at least one new thing

 

[Texas Proud]

No way this would have ended up with a conviction if it had gone to court...smart lawyer would have cleaned up the mess in no time...problem is, Craig is guilty, knew he was guilty, was hoping to plead out to a lesser charge and then hope the story never came out. It did and he's done.

He can't explain away a guilty plea, no matter how hard he tries.

What I would have said...

 

[ERD50]

I would guess they bring a hole saw.

And a de-burring tool? Ouch!

-ERD50

 

[samclem]

you force gay men into closets with your constitutional amendments banning gay marriage and then you hunt them down once you've locked them behind your partitions.

this is shooting fish in a barrel and calling yourselves sportsmen.

I'm not clear on how lack of gay marriage forces gays to have sex in public rest rooms. This type of activity should incense decent gays who have been stigmatized enough. It seems to me that the best thing the gay community could do would be to come out (pun intended) strongly against any lewdness (gay or straight) in public. And, yes, two people ("g8-t" or straight) having sex in the "privacy" of an airport toilet stall is still sex in public.

 

[Brat]

He may really be bi-sexual.

Frankly, were he my husband I would cease sexual activity and go the my physician to assure I hadn't acquired any stds. On the same day I would go to a domestic relations lawyer and figure out my options.

While Idaho isn't known to be generous to women seeking a divorce I doubt that he will find an 'understanding' domestic relations judge in that venue.

It isn't a matter of not loving him or even 'understanding', it is a matter of preserving the wife's health and marital assets - and that is exactly what I would tell my children.

 

[lazygood4nothinbum]

I'm not clear on how lack of gay marriage forces gays to have sex in public rest rooms. This type of activity should incense decent gays who have been stigmatized enough. It seems to me that the best thing the gay community could do would be to come out (pun intended) strongly against any lewdness (gay or straight) in public. And, yes, two people ("g8-t" or straight) having sex in the "privacy" of an airport toilet stall is still sex in public.

that isn't what i said and you know it. by gay marriage i meant that gays are not even permitted by str8s to enjoy basic human rights. what i said, if you'd only open your heart enough to listen, is that for at least 100s of years str8s have forced gays to hide their sexuality. so, fine, it has been hidden. congrats. you got just what you wanted. but now want even more. it is not enough that you have forced the hiding. now you are poking your sticks into the hiding places. your witch hunt is relentless.

i am not justifying public sex (though wow did i have fun on a golf course that one time, and in the library stacks at college oh, right, and in that glass elevator at the mall--i was young, what did i know). what i am saying is that were gays to be allowed the same basic human rights that you have gone to war for, that you have sent your children to war for, so that you could enjoy such rights, that when you extend these rights to all humans, when you show that you consider even the lowly gay to be as fully human as you are, that maybe then, after time, once gays have had the opportunity over many years, maybe generations, to develop the same sense of self worth as str8s have enjoyed for 100s of years, that maybe then they will not compelled to hide their sexuality in a smelly stall. ick. cause i gotta tell you though i'm sure it is sacrilege to many here: it's way better on a golf course.

 

[lazygood4nothinbum]

True, but the difference is, when they hear messages directed at heterosexual activity, they acknowledge that those messages might actually apply to them. Whether they follow through is a whole 'nother thing entirely - As you said, "I am immune" "It won't happen to me" are likely responses. But that is different than " that doesn't apply to me". Subtle distinction yes, but for prevention and health promotion, the distinction results in different needed strategies/messages.

i'm still not sure i understand what you say. are you saying that the message delivers differently depending on your sexual orientation? if i were to say "jumping off this here 1000 foot high bridge will kill a gay person" does the str8 person think "hey, i bet i can jump off that there 1000 foot high bridge and survive"?

 

[bright eyed]

i'm thinking if you're sticking your front or backside under a stall, w/out mtg the person ever, you're not concerned so much about whether it's safe or not? or is there a flashing of the condom first?

 

[Moemg]

I have no problem with heterosexual or homosexual sex .What burns me up is when they are politically anti gay and they are homosexual or holier than thou and visiting prostitutes .