About death and money

[badatmath]

If anyone is still reading how hard is it to arrange burial/cremation if there is no funeral? I talked to "relative" about doing this after I read the article and they were quite offended and upset that I mentioned it so not sure if I should try to do it "secretly" in advance or how much trouble it actually is. We don't live in the same part of the country so estate settlement will be inconvenient at best. They have done all they are willing to do to make it "easy" for me. It was a strange conversation tbh esp as said relative has been telling me death was imminent for about 30 years. . . .

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

If anyone is still reading how hard is it to arrange burial/cremation if there is no funeral? I talked to "relative" about doing this after I read the article and they were quite offended and upset that I mentioned it so not sure if I should try to do it "secretly" in advance or how much trouble it actually is. We don't live in the same part of the country so estate settlement will be inconvenient at best. They have done all they are willing to do to make it "easy" for me.

The Federal Trade Commission's "Funeral Rule" states that funeral homes have to provide you with an itemized price list and allow you to pick and choose whatever you want. They cannot require you to purchase any of the line items other than one service fee.

This might be helpful: https://www.nationalcremation.com/cremation-information/am-i-required-by-law-to-use-a-funeral-home

 

[badatmath]

The Federal Trade Commission's "Funeral Rule" states that funeral homes have to provide you with an itemized price list and allow you to pick and choose whatever you want. They cannot require you to purchase any of the line items other than one service fee.

This might be helpful: https://www.nationalcremation.com/cremation-information/am-i-required-by-law-to-use-a-funeral-home

Thanks!! I've not really ever thought about this before since I knew I'd not have a service. (No family to attend). Looks like the state where I expect the death to require a funeral director.

 

[foxcreek9]

I thought about it for a minute or two at the time, but there could be legal ramifications for doing that...even though I was personal representative/executor. In the end, just decided the amount was not enough to pursue anything or take any chances. And again, it was small refunds for prepaid stuff - wasn't any money that we were expecting.

Endorse it with your name followed by "Affiant", since you are named as the executor. That is what I did with similar items from my dad's estate. Unless the estate is contentious there will no problems.

 

[Route246]

I'm going to start writing an EOL Notebook.

Page one in very large print is going to say to obtain copies of my death certificate (originals and copies, depending on what is required) before starting any estate matters.

I haven't figured out how to do business continuity but page one will also make sure my cellphone is kept active as that is used by 2-factor authentication and to keep my auto pay accounts for my domain (E-Mail account) active or E-Mail access will die for my E-Mail (I have nothing to hide in E-Mail).

 

[sengsational]

A question about funeral pre-planning...


I thought I saw posts on er-org in the past 6 months that people had used some national company for more of a pre-planned or turn-key funeral. In fact, I thought it was this thread, but I didn't find reference to it. I thought I remembered reading one person say they used this company and another person say they did too.


Does anyone know about that company? I contacted funeral consumer's alliance (I posted a link to this all-volunteer organization above), but in my geography, there's only one place that gives members a discount, so the only value was that they pointed you to the one place. So I wanted to investigate pre-payment options with a national company vs pre-paying a local outfit, but can't find reference to it any more.

 

[braumeister]

I thought I saw posts on er-org in the past 6 months that people had used some national company for more of a pre-planned or turn-key funeral. In fact, I thought it was this thread, but I didn't find reference to it. I thought I remembered reading one person say they used this company and another person say they did too.

Possibly the Neptune Society?

 

[sengsational]

Possibly the Neptune Society?

That was it. I saw another discussion thread, which was happening concurrent with this thread: https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f27/neptune-society-121452.html#post3068328

 

[Winemaker]

DW's grandmother bought a pre planned funeral back in the 80's and she passed in '99. The funeral was entirely paid for, but we got a 1099 for the amount of the funeral, which, in essence, was an annuity, and since we didn't buy it, it was considered income to us.

 

[calmloki]

That was it. I saw another discussion thread, which was happening concurrent with this thread: https://www.early-retirement.org/forums/f27/neptune-society-121452.html#post3068328

Been in touch with Neptune. Their prices are a bit tricky. We're pretty callous about corpse care after death, I'm good with a hole in the dirt and feed the planet back, but probably a container of ashes is easier for those who remain. Guess you need body pickup, permit to cremate, cremation, container for ashes - and I think you can provide your own coffee can. Then there are add-ons. Bottom of the price list it's about $1500? Upper goes past $10-15K (been a few days). It goes up fast for viewings, special cardboard boxes, transport from wherever you croak it to where you want the ashes sent. Somber speakers, DJ, interpretive dance troupe, action photographer...

Some of those things may be bogus because death makes me uncomfortable too - I'm also contacting local crematoriums just to get a comparison. Would like to pre-pay and have a single phone number for whoever is left behind trying to take care of business.

 

[aja8888]

What did you use for your EOL notebook? Self created or something you purchased? If purchased, did you find it to your liking? Thanks.

Been in touch with Neptune. Their prices are a bit tricky. We're pretty callous about corpse care after death, I'm good with a hole in the dirt and feed the planet back, but probably a container of ashes is easier for those who remain. Guess you need body pickup, permit to cremate, cremation, container for ashes - and I think you can provide your own coffee can. Then there are add-ons. Bottom of the price list it's about $1500? Upper goes past $10-15K (been a few days). It goes up fast for viewings, special cardboard boxes, transport from wherever you croak it to where you want the ashes sent. Somber speakers, DJ, interpretive dance troupe, action photographer...

Some of those things may be bogus because death makes me uncomfortable too - I'm also contacting local crematoriums just to get a comparison. Would like to pre-pay and have a single phone number for whoever is left behind trying to take care of business.

For three family deaths I handled, I used Direct Cremation locally for about $1,000 all in with body pickup, cremation service, 12 certified death certificates, and the ashes delivered back to me in a wooden box. All done, neat and quick.

For the memorial services, I used our local church for not much money. We have a church here that handles these services very nicely and the facilities are great.

 

[Sunset]

DW's grandmother bought a pre planned funeral back in the 80's and she passed in '99. The funeral was entirely paid for, but we got a 1099 for the amount of the funeral, which, in essence, was an annuity, and since we didn't buy it, it was considered income to us.

I find that bizarre that you would get a 1099, as she paid for it with her money. It's not like it was a gift from the funeral home.

However, there have been many strange (illegal?) things done with pre-paid funerals.

Here, DD prepaid for his, then the company holding the cash/annuity took too much out and made poor investments, they lost a lot of the money, they settled with the State (rather than go to jail?).
It paid for his funeral.
We never got a 1099.

 

[Morgan22]

Been in touch with Neptune. Their prices are a bit tricky. We're pretty callous about corpse care after death, I'm good with a hole in the dirt and feed the planet back, but probably a container of ashes is easier for those who remain. Guess you need body pickup, permit to cremate, cremation, container for ashes - and I think you can provide your own coffee can. Then there are add-ons. Bottom of the price list it's about $1500? Upper goes past $10-15K (been a few days). It goes up fast for viewings, special cardboard boxes, transport from wherever you croak it to where you want the ashes sent. Somber speakers, DJ, interpretive dance troupe, action photographer...

Some of those things may be bogus because death makes me uncomfortable too - I'm also contacting local crematoriums just to get a comparison. Would like to pre-pay and have a single phone number for whoever is left behind trying to take care of business.

If you are in CA the Tulip Society can do a bare bones cremation. They list prices on their website too. https://www.tulipcremation.com/

 

[The Cosmic Avenger]

DW's grandmother bought a pre planned funeral back in the 80's and she passed in '99. The funeral was entirely paid for, but we got a 1099 for the amount of the funeral, which, in essence, was an annuity, and since we didn't buy it, it was considered income to us.

I agree with Sunset, this doesn't compute; the estate often pays for a funeral before disbursing funds to the heirs, so I don't understand how the cost of the funeral is income to the family...none of which are necessarily heirs! And it should be presumed that the funeral was paid for with taxable income....unless these pre-paid plans are tax deductible? That's the only thing I can think of.

Not doubting you, Winemaker, just trying to figure out what to look out for!

 

[joesxm3]

The PP I got for stepdad earned interest until it was used. Maybe 1099-INT? I am going to call later to ask if we will get one.

 

[braumeister]

For three family deaths I handled, I used Direct Cremation locally for about $1,000 all in with body pickup, cremation service, 12 certified death certificates, and the ashes delivered back to me in a wooden box. All done, neat and quick.

Same here, although generally in the $1,500 range.

 

[all4j]

Not an expert by any definition, but I do know there is a difference between pre-planned, pre-paid, burial/funeral insurance, & I'm sure more. The insurance/annuity business tout untold variations; which can also be impacted by state law. That coupled with people being uneasy about funerals &/or not understanding financial products can produce interesting results.

What to watch for? Basically I'd say who holds the $ in the interim, what is done with it, & who gets the payout. In many cases, it is basically an insurance policy, although it may be a trust. The beneficiary might well be the funeral home, but could also be a person. Sometimes it is done in such a way as to get it out of the estate. Just like life insurance, there may be taxable amounts & so I can see a 1099 being issued.

I suspect details aren't known/communicated well!

 

[sengsational]

Been in touch with Neptune. Their prices are a bit tricky. ...

I went to their web site and was put-off by the "free lunch" thing... you know, that marketing thing they use a free meal to make you feel obligated to buy something you otherwise wouldn't. I'll certainly get other options and prices before committing to anything.

 

[REWahoo]

I went to their web site and was put-off by the "free lunch" thing... you know, that marketing thing they use a free meal to make you feel obligated to buy something you otherwise wouldn't. I'll certainly get other options and prices before committing to anything.

I looked into Neptune and got the same vibes. A little research reveals their salespeople apparently work on a commission only basis, not my favorite environment as a consumer.

That said, the BBB does give them a good rating so they may be OK.

 

[rayvt]

I'm also contacting local crematoriums just to get a comparison. Would like to pre-pay and have a single phone number for whoever is left behind trying to take care of business.

Be careful with prepaid plans. If you move before you die, it may be very difficult to get the money moved with you, especially if it has been decades since you paid.

Guess how I know.

 

[lemming]

I am not going to quibble about amounts that I think are reasonable. One thousand seems low-Ten thousand seems high. But I want to find the place that will pick up-process-and deliver.
I want my CCRC or Medical facility to be able to make that phone call.
My executor is someone who lives on the other side of the country and has very little contact with my side of the family. I don't want a gathering of people or a eulogy. He is there to distribute financial remains not physical. I need to get this figured out soon-just in case things go from worse to worse.

 

[Brat]

We belong to the Oregon Memorial Society, a not for profit society. They list mortuaries, from there I can see their prices.

 

[SecondCor521]

I am not going to quibble about amounts that I think are reasonable. One thousand seems low-Ten thousand seems high. But I want to find the place that will pick up-process-and deliver.
I want my CCRC or Medical facility to be able to make that phone call.
My executor is someone who lives on the other side of the country and has very little contact with my side of the family. I don't want a gathering of people or a eulogy. He is there to distribute financial remains not physical. I need to get this figured out soon-just in case things go from worse to worse.

My Mom was cremated. After she passed away, it was literally one phone call to them and they were there within half an hour.

I think I made the call, but that was because I was there in the room when she passed away and I'm sure my Dad wasn't in a place mentally to make the call. And it may have been a call to hospice who then called the cremation place since my Mom was on hospice at the time.

Anyway, bottom line is that it was very easy, efficient, professional, and inexpensive, and I think just letting the CCRC or medical facility know the information (they ask for this information once you start getting "old") would get it handled well.

Although I think in terms of cremation/burial/funeral stuff, that's handled by a point person, not a document. So they may just ask you who, not what. But hopefully you have a friend or family member who would be willing to make the one phone call to the cremation place for you.

 

[braumeister]

We will both be cremated and interred at a national cemetery (I'm retired military). For anyone who is eligible and wants to do that, here is a tip. You can't just call them up and arrange it -- you have to be preauthorized.

It's a simple process, but definitely a good idea to do it before you're gone. Once approved, they will send you a letter that will speed things up when needed.

Pre-need eligibility for burial in a VA cemetery

You can apply to find out in advance if you can be buried in a VA national cemetery. This is called a pre-need determination of eligibility—and it can help make the burial planning process easier for your family members in their time of need. Follow the steps below to apply

 

[Teacher Terry]

Lemming, our local crematorium has staff 24-7 so it’s literally one phone call and they pick you up for a third of the price of a funeral home.