Opinion: Financial Independence has nothing to do with being a millionare

[W2R]

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/f...ing-to-do-with-being-a-millionaire-2019-05-20

I find this quote from the article to be really offensive....

For example, people say you should spend your money on experiences, not things. There is some spiritual component to this that I don’t get. I like spending money on experiences (particularly travel), but I like spending money on things more. Clothes, in particular.

You feel (and act) differently when you are wearing an expensive suit and an expensive pair of shoes. People who make $150,000 a year and still get all their clothes at Target do this not out of frugality, but low self-esteem. It is good and right to spend money on yourself now and then.

I added the bold.

Hmm, I wonder if I feel or act differently when wearing expensive clothing and shoes, than I feel or act when wearing "retiree casual" (shorts, t-shirt, and sandals)? Well, OK, I guess I do feel more relaxed when dressed comfortably, but I don't think my behavior changes much. I am not the type who starts yelling or laughing loudly, burping obnoxiously, or swearing a lot just because I am wearing comfortable clothing. I don't know this but I suspect that I tend to come off as rather stilted and overly formal in my interactions, even when wearing "retiree casual".

If one has no other reason for self esteem, then I guess one's self esteem could be based solely on the dollar value of one's clothing. Frank and I just don't feel like that matters at all. Substance, not style, makes the difference for most people.

I do like pretty clothing, in the same way that I like the pretty paint color on my wall. I don't get my self esteem from the paint color, either.

The Sherwin Williams paint is in a color called Malted Milk. There, ain't I great.

 

[HI Bill]

Salespitch by a former Lehman Bros. ETF trader. Of COURSE he hates the Millionaire Next Door. It doesn't allow him to feel good about himself!

 

[unclemick]

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/f...ing-to-do-with-being-a-millionaire-2019-05-20

I find this quote from the article to be really offensive....

For example, people say you should spend your money on experiences, not things. There is some spiritual component to this that I don’t get. I like spending money on experiences (particularly travel), but I like spending money on things more. Clothes, in particular.

You feel (and act) differently when you are wearing an expensive suit and an expensive pair of shoes. People who make $150,000 a year and still get all their clothes at Target do this not out of frugality, but low self-esteem. It is good and right to spend money on yourself now and then.

I added the bold.

I/we still hit the thrift stores - aka Salvation Army , Goodwill. DAV, et al. Scoring a good buy or a miss priced item is priceless joy.

There are words beyond 'frugal' or even 'cheap'.

Now a swell o mundo restaurant once in a while - that's another story. There are a few other quirks where spending viewed by others might be viewed as extravagant.

heh heh heh - Left handed INTJ ER . Duck tape on tennis shoes is a statement if you are ER. Sort of lost discipline on dryer sheets though.

 

[Mmm Rrr]

The Sherwin Williams paint is in a color called Malted Milk. There, ain't I great.

My living room is painted Malted Milk, it is lovely and I like the way it changes with differing light through the day!

 

[albireo13]

Man, this guy is obsessed with money.

He needs a life beyond his bank account.
Perhaps he didn't get enough hugs when he was a little kid.

 

[W2R]

My living room is painted Malted Milk, it is lovely and I like the way it changes with differing light through the day!

Oh how cool, and mine changes too!! Mine has a pinkish hue most of the time which makes it a lot more girly and perfect for a woman living alone like me. My late ex would have *hated* it.

But nobody ever says, "Hey, that W2R, you know she's really SOMETHING and such an inestimably fine person! For example did you know she has her walls painted with SW Malted Milk?"

 

[walkinwood]

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/f...ing-to-do-with-being-a-millionaire-2019-05-20

I find this quote from the article to be really offensive....

For example, people say you should spend your money on experiences, not things. There is some spiritual component to this that I don’t get. I like spending money on experiences (particularly travel), but I like spending money on things more. Clothes, in particular.

You feel (and act) differently when you are wearing an expensive suit and an expensive pair of shoes. People who make $150,000 a year and still get all their clothes at Target do this not out of frugality, but low self-esteem. It is good and right to spend money on yourself now and then.

I added the bold.

I haven't read the article & will not. I wonder why we see so many of these posts. Stay away from that crap and if you accidentally land on one - just move on.

 

[Gallaher]

I made a lot more than $150k a year and always wore nice suits...never paid more than $500 for one. Usually bought 2 suits per year.
Usually bought 1-2 pairs of Levi 501s and 3-4 pairs of Costco jeans...they cost about $12.00 today. Costco Oxfords for work. A few T-shirts and I’m good.
I just never believed that my clothes were an indicator of self worth. Still don’t.
World is full of odd people.

 

[Winemaker]

Every year there are magazine articles that proclaim the death of cargo shorts because they're so out of fashion, so horrible, and so meh. And every year more and more are sold because they are so practical, so one can carry wallets, phones, keys, money, glasses and personal protection. Fashion be damned.

 

[Bigdawg]

I do like pretty clothing, in the same way that I like the pretty paint color on my wall. I don't get my self esteem from the paint color, either.

The Sherwin Williams paint is in a color called Malted Milk. There, ain't I great.

Oh, you name dropper!. LOL

 

[Mdlerth]

Maybe they sell a lot because it's all they stock

Every year there are magazine articles that proclaim the death of cargo shorts because they're so out of fashion, so horrible, and so meh. And every year more and more are sold because they are so practical, so one can carry wallets, phones, keys, money, glasses and personal protection. Fashion be damned.

I was at Costco over the weekend and they had tables and tables of shorts, ALL of them cargo shorts with those extra pockets. You can indeed stuff no end of cargo in those pockets...

...but it's a chicken and egg problem. If it were more difficult to carry all that crap, maybe I'd figure out how to do without some of it.

 

[Jerry1]

Every year there are magazine articles that proclaim the death of cargo shorts because they're so out of fashion, so horrible, and so meh. And every year more and more are sold because they are so practical, so one can carry wallets, phones, keys, money, glasses and personal protection. Fashion be damned.

It’s either cargo shorts or a fanny pack. I’ll go with the cargo shorts every time.

 

[sengsational]

When I see the drivers of these things climb out, it seems to me that most are below average in height. So maybe they are trying to increase their self-esteem.

We used to have a running joke at the bar that overlooked the intercoastal...the size and decibel level of the boat was inversely proportional to the owners (body part), um I meant "height".

 

[jollystomper]

It has been my observation that people who deem others to have low self-esteem for not behaving in the way they think they should are the ones with low self-esteem themselves, as they need the reassurance of people behaving like they would.

It reminds me of a (now former) BIL and SIL who would look down on us during their "good times" and suggest we had "problems" because we chose not to live high on the hog like they were. Of course, when their "good times" ended where do you think they came running for help...

I like dressing nice because I look nice (yeah, I know, vanity - I have gotten some indirect compliments from DW's female friends that fed my ego ), but for my next suit I more likely go "frugally" to a place like the Mens Wearhouse during a sale. Whenever I see a guy boast about a very expensive suit I think "sheesh, you could have spend a couple of hundred and have a lot left over and still look as bad as you do" ).

 

[Offgrid Organic Farmer]

I always thought the exact opposite. There must be a self esteem issue with someone who has to have their clothes speak to their status.

But anyway, if someone gets pleasure from buying expensive clothes versus travel its not my place to think they're wrong.

I agree.

Our goal for our retirement was to live 'out in the boonies' in a dense forest doing some gardening where we could see wildlife almost every day. As a result, my daily clothes are 'farm' clothes.

My suits live in the closet.

 

[W2R]

Oh, you name dropper!. LOL

LOL!

 

[Scrapr]

We used to have a running joke at the bar that overlooked the intercoastal...the size and decibel level of the boat was inversely proportional to the owners (body part), um I meant "height".

Huh,,,same at the construction site. If I see a GC roll up in a lifted big tire truck I won't quote them. All of a sudden I'm too busy

 

[friar1610]

Yes, but it's incredibly common. IMO one of the triumphs of late 20th-century marketing was to convince people to wear clothes advertising the supplier and to pay extra for the privilege.

In the 60's I was assigned to the Philippines by the Navy. Most of the Filipino men who worked on our base wore slacks that had a small label indicating the tailor who had made them sewn above the rear right pocket. I thought that was curious - after all, labels belonged on the inside of clothes, not on the outside. Fast forward 50 years. Those Filipino guys and their tailors were trend setters!

 

[FreeBear]

I only wear clothing that includes advertising on it if I was given the stuff for free. And then I only wear it while I am gardening, painting or changing the oil in my car.

It was even cheaper to bring home shirts with the old w*rkplace logo, better yet, ones embroidered with boondoggle projects. They were great when rehabbing my old house. I have a ton of such shirts, and, fortunately, not even enough manual labor w*rk to wear them all out.

 

[RobbieB]

All just choices.

For him it's clothes, for me it's wagyu.

 

[karen1972]

I took this as someone who is just frustrated by the amount of articles written that talk about not spending or buying expensive things.

However they completely missed the boat. My honey buys only name brand from hair product to clothing. However, even name brands have sales, discounts, clearance, etc and if you are patient and look around you can easily get things for 60-70% off at which point its similar pricing to the Targets. I should know, when I met my BF he was spending $100 on BOSS tshirts (really undershirts)... holy cow.. he just bought and paid whatever it was when he went into the store. The whole I'm not saying you can't have it, its your money but wouldn't it be nice if you could buy 2 or 3 for the same price.

 

[NW-Bound]

More than 100 years ago, Thorstein Veblen coined the term "conspicuous consumption" in his book titled The Theory of the Leisure Class (1899). Veblen also talked about rich people taking pride in doing as little as possible, or taking activities that resulted in no economic output.

It just occurred to me that ERs are almost by definition a "Leisure Class", no matter what clothes they wear.

 

[MichaelB]

More than 100 years ago, Thorstein Veblen coined the term "conspicuous consumption" in his book titled The Theory of the Leisure Class (1899). Veblen also talked about rich people taking pride in doing as little as possible, or taking activities that resulted in no economic output.

It just occurred to me that ERs are almost by definition a "Leisure Class", no matter what clothes they wear.

So, consistent with Veblen’s definition, E-R Forum members would be proudly known as “Conspicuous Abstainers”?

 

[NW-Bound]

So, consistent with Veblen’s definition, E-R Forum members would be proudly known as “Conspicuous Abstainers”?

Only those with a low WR.


PS. On 2nd thoughts, conspicuous consumption is not about whether the buyer of an item can afford it or not. It's about showing other people your Hermès bag with a price tag of $50K, while not caring how that bag is different than another Hermès bag costing merely $20K. The price that you pay for something is what is important.

 

[LRDave]

He also says: "...I’m a lucky guy. Cool job, great marriage, nice house, fun hobbies — I have it all...."

Every time I hear 'I have it all', I tend to think: 'next scene'...just don't come home early unannounced some day.

I'm a great believer in the Cosmic 2 X 4..........