Your recent repair? - 2021 to ?

[Music Lover]

As for the practicality of repairing your own appliances... Well, I figure a chance at potentially wasting $110 is worth it.

Appliances are really cheap these days. I've been watching "The Price is Right" from 1983 on Pluto TV, and dishwashers then were $600 to $1000, not much different than today. Actually, almost all the appliances from that era have the same price as today. That's astounding. The problem today is a labor call is going to be a few hundred. Add in a part for a few hundred and people just buy new because the repair is not worth it.

But if you can DYI, it is worth it for a relatively new appliance.

The environmental impact of all the appliances being thrown away after just a few years is stunning.

I know that at least some of an appliance can be recycled but that takes energy too.

And eventually all those 30 and 40 year old fridges will stop working and all that's left will be high end fridges that most people can't afford or don't want to spent that much on. So 95% of people will own basic appliances that last 6-8 years. Fridge, stove, dishwasher...potentially every 2 or 3 years you'll be replacing one of them. For the rest of your life.

 

[JoeWras]

I know that at least some of an appliance can be recycled but that takes energy too.

And eventually all those 30 and 40 year old fridges will stop working and all that's left will be high end fridges that most people can't afford or don't want to spent that much on. So 95% of people will own basic appliances that last 6-8 years. Fridge, stove, dishwasher...potentially every 2 or 3 years you'll be replacing one of them. For the rest of your life.

You're numbers are in the ballpark and the point is well taken.

We have a thread here with people wringing their hands over power generation, while meanwhile, the amount of waste we are producing rises. These crappy appliances take (dirty) power to build and mine materials, is made of plastic, a derivative of oil, and fills our landfills.

 

[ERD50]

You're numbers are in the ballpark and the point is well taken.

We have a thread here with people wringing their hands over power generation, while meanwhile, the amount of waste we are producing rises. These crappy appliances take (dirty) power to build and mine materials, is made of plastic, a derivative of oil, and fills our landfills.

Agreed. I really wish the environmental groups would jump on this bandwagon.

Appliances should be more easily repaired (easy to replace modular parts). That's not always so easy, but in those cases, so practical refurbish/reuse method. Maybe swap out the appliance on site so the homeowner is up and running, then send the unit back for refurbishing, and resale instead of junking it.

There was a recent interesting youtube video posted (int he repair thread I think), of a guy who strips these down for just the high value parts - so 90% of the unit s still scrapped. Though I guess much of it is recycled, but reuse is so much better from an energy standpoint.

The example I often give is these 'controller boards', and/or 'switch panels' - each is a unique design costing several hundred dollars to replace (if you can even buy a replacement for an 8 year old appliance). These could be made much more generic, like a standard 2x3, 3x4, 4x6 (or whatever) switch array (just a different cover plate for the switch labels), and they would be <$10 instead of $300. I buy stuff like that in single digit quantities from ebay or Ali-Express for some of my hobby projects, for $3 each.

Here's one with a larger switch matrix, 16 switches, 4x4, $4.70 with shipping in single qty.
It has a very simple, generic interface, easy to control from any cheap micro-controller.

Cheap generic relay boards are available too. There's really no need for all these unique designs, just different software to control them.

https://tinyurl.com/2522x8tg

-ERD50

 

[ERD50]

More pics attached.

So this was a Whirlpool. The failure was of an O-ring in the sump. The symptom was water leaking underneath. Because I got a class action letter which described the issue, I pretty much knew it was the diverter motor seal. ...

The diverter is a simple disk that causes water to either go through the bottom spray arm, or top spray arm. It slowly spins each cycle. .....

Hah! I bet that was the problem with our old Dishwasher (left at the previous home). The top arm stopped spinning - I found some stuff clogging it, or a bad seal to the arm, and got it working again.

It failed again, but I never found the cause. I bet that was it, the water never got diverted to the top! That was deeper than I looked.

-ERD50

 

[sengsational]

....

The problem might be that swappable parts means no ability to distinguish a device based on extra features. I'd like a push to make things more repairable, certainly. Consumer Reports has a push for that on cell phones. I guess Apple is targeted since they make phones hard to fix, and only "allow" fixing under control of their repair process (no competition).

 

[ERD50]

The problem might be that swappable parts means no ability to distinguish a device based on extra features. ....

I don't agree. There's is plenty of room for variation w/o resorting to custom parts for everything.

Computer mice, keyboards, monitors, disk drives, printers, etc as examples. I can buy cheap generic to fit my needs, or special ones for gaming or video/audio production. They are all pretty much plug and play.

I don't have to buy a new computer if my keyboard or mouse go out, or try to buy one from the manufacturer, only to find out it's been discontinued, and now I can't use my computer anymore and it ends up in recycling (and probably most ends up in a landfill, or a highly polluting 'recycling' process). And yet, computers come is all sizes, shapes and capabilities - they manage to distinguish themselves from one another.

-ERD50

 

[travelover]

......... I've been watching "The Price is Right" from 1983 on Pluto TV........

Is this a cry for help? We are here.

 

[JoeWras]

Is this a cry for help? We are here.

Ha ha ha!

No, when I need background noise, or just want to see happy people, I turn on the Price is Right channel on PlutoTV.

Everyone is always so happy, even most of the losers. We have so much gloom in this world, so much swearing, so many tribes. On TPIR, it all disappears and everyone is happy.

Bob, in retrospect, is a little creepy though. And who the heck ever thought a "Baker's Rack" was a good idea?

 

[ls99]

I have four outdoor chairs which late DW bought. Aluminium frame with plastic woven sitting and back surface. Well, over the years the sun's UV emissions has degraded the plastic so when sitting on it the plastic stuff broke into little pieces. Hmmm what to do?

Turns out had some 1/4" T111 left over from making an enclosed trailer into a sauna, it was enought to cut the seat pattern for four chairs and about 4" strips for backrest. Some judicious application of a saber saw got the surfaces made. Drilled sme holes through T111 into the frame, insert screws t0 hold them in place. When I get around to it will apply some waterproofing, can't rush these things.

Makes for great camp chairs. Won't win any "house beautiful" awards.

 

[sengsational]

I don't agree. There's is plenty of room for variation w/o resorting to custom parts for everything.

Computer mice, keyboards, monitors, disk drives, printers, etc as examples. I can buy cheap generic to fit my needs, or special ones for gaming or video/audio production. They are all pretty much plug and play.

I don't have to buy a new computer if my keyboard or mouse go out, or try to buy one from the manufacturer, only to find out it's been discontinued, and now I can't use my computer anymore and it ends up in recycling (and probably most ends up in a landfill, or a highly polluting 'recycling' process). And yet, computers come is all sizes, shapes and capabilities - they manage to distinguish themselves from one another.

-ERD50

It's great for consumer choice, but I think people shopped primarily by price, despite various shapes and sizes. I was thinking that given a board with certain capability maximums, two companies using that board, going after the same demographic will end up with the same set of features after just a few iterations. Say a product designer comes up with a creative way to leverage the board. If it attracts customers, the competition would have that feature in the next release with much less effort than if they needed circuit design.

 

[ERD50]

It's great for consumer choice, but I think people shopped primarily by price, despite various shapes and sizes. I was thinking that given a board with certain capability maximums, two companies using that board, going after the same demographic will end up with the same set of features after just a few iterations. Say a product designer comes up with a creative way to leverage the board. If it attracts customers, the competition would have that feature in the next release with much less effort than if they needed circuit design.

But that's all (mostly) in the software. The panel on one microwave isn't much different from their competitor, there's X number of switches - and the cover-plate/overlay can have a different look. They can assign any feature they want to any one of those switches. If one company wants more features that need more hardware, they get a standard relay board with 8 relays vs 4, etc.

Having standard keyboard and mice and HDMI hasn't kept one PC mfg from differentiating their product from others.

-ERD50

 

[38Chevy454]

Technically more of a repair avoidance, but part of good preventative maintenance.

I changed the PTU (power transfer unit, sort of the transfer case for the AWD, sends power to rear driveshaft) fluid on my 2016 Ford Explorer. To facilitate this and for future fluid changes, I drilled and tapped the case for a drain plug. Ford did start putting a drain plug in some later model PTUs, but for mine it is "lifetime fluid"; which is really not. It's a known problem that the PTU and its fluid should be changed because: 1) It is located where it gets little to no air flow and right by hot exhaust and other engine heat, and 2) Has low 18 oz of fluid in it. There is a fill plug, but no drain on the as-built configuration. Many people stick a hose down and try to suck the old fluid out. Adding a drain makes it easier and better assures getting as much of the old fluid out.

My Explorer had 32K miles and the original factory fluid was not real bad burnt dark brown, but also was getting fairly brown color compared to new fluid. The recommended fluid is GL-5 gear oil 75W-140, synthetic is recommended. Here's the pictures of the drilled and tapped hole in the bottom of the case, and then with the 1/4 NPT plug in place. Half a quart of new gear oil is cheap insurance, and now future drain and refills will be easy to do. Fill plug is up to left of the pictures, just fill until fluid is at bottom of the fill plug.

The Ford PTU fluid overheating problem is basically for any of the AWD vehicles like Edge, Explorer, Taurus, Fusion, Flex that use the PTU instead of a transfer case like traditional 4x4 trucks and similar drivetrains.

 

[NW-Bound]

To facilitate this and for future fluid changes, I drilled and tapped the case for a drain plug...

Wow, the case is thicker than I would have thought.

And it is brass? Is it then aluminum-clad?

It shows how little I know about the construction and manufacturing of cars.

 

[JoeWras]

I always have utmost respect for DYIers that just go ahead a "tap a thread."


Great job!

 

[38Chevy454]

Wow, the case is thicker than I would have thought.

And it is brass? Is it then aluminum-clad?

It shows how little I know about the construction and manufacturing of cars.

Case is aluminum, the goldish color is the fluid still leaking a little out; which looks less brown color when it's thin. Easy to drill and tap. About 1/2 inch or maybe little more thickness at that location. There have been several people that determined this general location is good for the drain plug, based on the internal design and case design. I did not just drill and tap at random spot. Although the location is about the only place you can reasonably get a drill in there. Exhaust is right below, I used one of my long drill bits. Regular length drill bit puts the drill chuck at the exhaust and can't drill as straight. Sure you could loosen and move the exhaust, but that's asking for broken bolts and lot more work.

 

[Walt34]

I always have utmost respect for DYIers that just go ahead a "tap a thread."

It's not all that difficult as long as you have (and use!) EXACTLY the correct drill bit and tap. I was apprehensive a the first few times doing that since you're drilling a hole in something that isn't really broken and that does kind of "go against the grain". That and the almost certainty that if you screw it up it's gonna be expensive to fix.

 

[NW-Bound]

Case is aluminum, the goldish color is the fluid still leaking a little out...

Thank you. I feel much better.

PS. By the way, if that screwed-in plug works itself loose and causes loss of fluid while driving, it could be a heap of problem.

 

[travelover]

.......... There is a fill plug, but no drain on the as-built configuration. .........

This post gave me flashbacks as an retired MegaMotors employee. We were required to submit a certain number of cost reduction ideas per year and this looks like one of the typical stupid ones. Generally, the ideas came from outside the actual part releasing area as the affected engineers didn't want to sabotage their own parts, but once management got hold of a potential savings, they'd hound the affected engineer into incorporating it.
I don't see too much of this nonsense on my Toyota.

 

[travelover]

Thank you. I feel much better.

PS. By the way, if that screwed-in plug works itself loose and causes loss of fluid while driving, it could be a heap of problem.

The same could be said of the engine oil pan drain plug, which every ICE vehicle has. Another reason I do my own oil changes and use a torque wrench to tighten said plug.

 

[NW-Bound]

The same could be said of the engine oil pan drain plug, which every ICE vehicle has. Another reason I do my own oil changes and use a torque wrench to tighten said plug.

I dunno.

In my life, I only heard of one occasion when a coworker had his drain plug falling off after an oil change. He stopped immediately by the side of the road when the warning light came on. The service shop came to tow the car back, apologized profusely, and said no engine damage occurred. Right!

But I have seen a few instances, one happening to me, and a couple more to relatives, where the asshat used an impact wrench to tighten the plug. Next time the plug was removed, the threads on the oil pan came out with it. It's criminal, but how can you prove it?

Nope. I change the oil myself.

 

[JoeWras]

It's not all that difficult as long as you have (and use!) EXACTLY the correct drill bit and tap. I was apprehensive a the first few times doing that since you're drilling a hole in something that isn't really broken and that does kind of "go against the grain". That and the almost certainty that if you screw it up it's gonna be expensive to fix.

It may also help to have quality tools to do so. My attempts have been poor, so I'm going to blame the cheap tap set I inherited from dad.

I've consigned myself to be a wood guy. I try to do everything with wood. I'm just not good with metalworking. Just one thing, wood gear cases don't work too well.

 

[Jerry1]

I don’t do much repair work theses days, but a walked my son in law through an air conditioning repair. The compressor unit stoped working. Likely an electrical issue as it was dead. Traced it to a relay and he picked up a new one for under $20 and he was back up and running. I’m proud of him. He gets in there and figures stuff out. A service call would have started at over $100 and who knows how bad they would have marked up the relay.

During the process, I bought him a new multimeter set for $50, so I guess the whole job was $70. It gave me a chance to talk to him about getting the right tools for the job (and still coming out ahead). By the time he was done he was testing the 24v from the thermostat and the new multimeter allowed him to know whether or not some capacitors had any current in them.

This is the meter set I got him. I think any home owner should have these three meters.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Klein-T...r-Premium-Electrical-Tool-Set-69355/316913518

 

[JoeWras]

A service call would have started at over $100 and who knows how bad they would have marked up the relay.

"Sir, you're going to need a new compressor. I recommend a full system replacement while you are at it."

"How much?"

"About $10k"

 

[Jerry1]

"Sir, you're going to need a new compressor. I recommend a full system replacement while you are at it."

"How much?"

"About $10k"

Actually, they will need a new unit. Come to learn in the process that the compressor is 30 years old. I didn’t verify that but it is old. Amazing how the old appliances just keep chugging along.

 

[JoeWras]

Actually, they will need a new unit. Come to learn in the process that the compressor is 30 years old. I didn’t verify that but it is old. Amazing how the old appliances just keep chugging along.

That's a really good lifetime!