Different paths for living life

[ivinsfan]

I wonder this sometimes too and can't decide if the happy go luckys are the smart ones.


I guess the main thing is if/when they pair up they should pair up with someone who shares their values or it could get bumpy.


Was having a talk with oldest DD early 40's about kids in her small HS class. Some are struggling, some are just getting by and some have really gone out and grabbed the world by the balls.


I don't know the happy quotient of the HS group but I'd like to know which bunch are happiest.


I consider my in law family pretty average.. we have 9 kids between 4 sibs...


8 kids have 4 year degrees.


one DN has advanced welding training and is now supervisor for a large national stainless steel company.


7 are married and all spouses have 4 year degrees.



of the 14 adults ...4 have advanced degrees.



Now the original 4 sibs have no college degrees, the one sister got a CPA and worked after the kids got in school. The 3 boys are 61 65 and 72 and are each still working in their own business.



Is it hardwired into us or is society changing ?

 

[Dtail]

Very timely thread.
My son is 31 and just got laid off from a job where he was earning ~32k. No debt and just cruising through life, while living a LBYM lifestyle with a grand total of 15k savings.
He is making more now on unemployment.
So he decides to come down to FLA and stay with me for 4 weeks. No issue there and enjoying his company.
He will leave on Apr 15th and I have made it clear to him that his life dreams are fine, but no monies from me to support it if he has financial issues.
His first grade teacher said he was lazy......

 

[ivinsfan]

Very timely thread.
My son is 31 and just got laid off from a job where he was earning ~32k. No debt and just cruising through life, while living a LBYM lifestyle with a grand total of 15k savings.
He is making more now on unemployment.
So he decides to come down to FLA and stay with me for 4 weeks. No issue there and enjoying his company.
He will leave on Apr 15th and I have made it clear to him that his life dreams are fine, but no monies from me to support it if he has financial issues.
His first grade teacher said he was lazy......

I don't know your son but I have a problem with any teacher that would call a six year old boy lazy. That's an easy way out for the teacher instead of trying to work with young kids.

 

[Amethyst]

Agree. Kids that age aren't entirely sure who they are yet. They are still looking/listening for adult direction. He could have had more slow-going genes than most kids, but some of those laid-back people can get a lot done in their own fashion. Sometimes, better than the chargers and drivers, and with less breakage.

I don't know your son but I have a problem with any teacher that would call a six year old boy lazy. That's an easy way out for the teacher instead of trying to work with young kids.

 

[brucethebroker]

I really hope the kids that are "coasting" figure it out. Sure, the job market is no longer the same as in the 60's, 70's & 80's, but there is still opportunity to figure it out. (Raise your hand if you had to work 2 jobs, or more, when younger, to make it for a few years).

Maybe some of the "coasting" kids are counting on us boomer parents to leave them a big nest egg?

 

[skyking1]

@Gumby, indeed. Who are we to judge?
The echo in here is deafening.

 

[Gumby]

... some of those laid-back people can get a lot done in their own fashion. Sometimes, better than the chargers and drivers, and with less breakage.

I always heard that if you want to know the most efficient way to accomplish a task, you should give it to a lazy person, as they will find the best way to do it with the least effort.

 

[Andre1969]

I really hope the kids that are "coasting" figure it out. Sure, the job market is no longer the same as in the 60's, 70's & 80's, but there is still opportunity to figure it out. (Raise your hand if you had to work 2 jobs, or more, when younger, to make it for a few years).

I don't really have a wide variety of people to sample from, but most of the "kids" in their 20's or early 30's are pretty much coasting, at this point. However, I know one who shows some promise. I think he's turning 28 in a few months. He graduated college, with a bachelor's degree in something that had to do with child counseling, I think. But, he worked, through school, as a bus driver, and now he's still working, two jobs. I forget what the main job is, but one of them is still driving a bus. So, he's willing to put in some hard work, and do what it takes.

Now, when he was younger he did total a fairly new Honda Civic. I rode with him, once, and his driving scared the hell out of me. Kind of your typical, macho-driven, indestructible attitude that a lot of them have at that age. I won't lie; I felt pretty much the same at that age. He was living with his parents, for awhile, but recently moved to DC. He got another car, a Hyundai Elantra, about 3 years ago. I don't know if it was brand-new, as cars all look alike to me these days, and they don't change them like they used to, but it was new-ish. So, I'd say he's doing pretty well. It's not cheap to live in DC, especially in a place where it's feasible to keep a car.

 

[flyingaway]

I think I wanted to do something in my early 20s, but failed a few attempts. I was not bold enough.
My life turned in another direction after I went back to school for graduate study at 28 and eventually got a Ph.D. I never imaged to do graduate study in my college years.

Now, my son, at 24, lost his job and moved back home. It appears that he is not desperate to find a job, since he wants to find a dream job.

 

[Lsbcal]

I think I wanted to do something in my early 20s, but failed a few attempts. I was not bold enough.
My life turned in another direction after I went back to school for graduate study at 28 and eventually got a Ph.D. I never imaged to do graduate study in my college years.

Now, my son, at 24, lost his job and moved back home. It appears that he is not desperate to find a job, since he wants to find a dream job.

Dream job ... hmmm. Never found that, but would have if I had been able to walk on water. Unfortunately I was just a decent engineer in Silicon Valley in the 70's, really bad luck .

The economy is projected to boom in a few months. Should that happen maybe he has a chance at getting good job offers?

 

[street]

I thinking of these young adults that I know. There is jobs in my area but it must not be the jobs they want. I remember jobs I didn't like but I was never without one. I sometimes had two jobs through my early life just because I could make more and save more.

I'm not saying that the people I know should do what I did. They wouldn't want that way of life just like I wouldn't want their way of life either. Neither is right or wrong but is just who we are and what we want to make of our life.

As far as telling a first grader he/she is lazy, is of poor judgement and a bad choice of words for a young mind!!

I remember when my son had to go and get evaluated to enter pre-school, they told him us he isn't ready and should be held home another year, he is nowhere ready and will struggle is school and life.

We did take those comment seriously. Make a long story short, but we started him early, he graduated early, and finished college early and has been in his chosen career almost 18 years (same company) he is 35 year old, and has made more money then I, in a year, then I did after 35 years.
So, if a teachers knows the child better then a parent does, I would question it thoroughly.

 

[Amethyst]

As a former manager, I wouldn't exactly give the task, itself, to the lazy one, because part of being lazy is thinking deadlines are for other people. I always consulted with them, though, and sometimes got good ideas. Also I often made them a liaison person, since they generally got on well with others.

I always heard that if you want to know the most efficient way to accomplish a task, you should give it to a lazy person, as they will find the best way to do it with the least effort.

 

[friar1610]

Anyway, I will never forget one day, early on that I handled a call for some minor offense, I think it was misdemeanor shoplifting. I processed the guy, fingerprints & photograph, write up the report, statement of charges and all that and since he wasn't local his bond was set rather high to assure the court that he would appear later. (At least where I worked the police have no influence on the amount of bond.) He didn't have the money so off to jail we went. All through this we just chatted about everyday stuff, I remember fishing was one topic, but just normal guy chatter stuff. He had a record, he'd been through the drill before so nothing came as a surprise and he knew what to expect. He'd screwed up, he knew it, I knew he knew it, so there was no need to dwell on that. As that steel barred door slid shut (just like in the movies) he looks at me and says "Thank you."

A bit surprised, I said "I just took you to jail. What on earth are you thanking me for?" He said "You treated me decent. Nobody hardly ever does that."

Made my day. I'd made the world, at least for that guy on that day, a little bit better place. I didn't always succeed but I did try to do that every day.

That’s a great story; thanks for sharing it.

 

[street]

I never set out to be wealthy, but I did want very much to be able to afford a "middle class lifestyle" meaning to own my own home (it didn't have to be big, in fact I didn't want one too big) and be able to afford a new car every ten years or so and to be able to afford to call a plumber. We never called a plumber when I was growing up because we couldn't afford that and I really, really hate plumbing. It's always an exercise in frustration because there's always some special tool I don't have, or some "reverse figure eight fitting" needed that only the store on the other side of the county carries. So to me, being able to afford a plumber when desired is one of the hallmarks of having "made it". Okay, so that's admittedly a low bar to clear but that was one of mine. Hey, I can be easily amused.

And I wanted to do something unique and positive, that not just anyone could do, that would in general make the world or at least my little corner of it a better place to be. So I became a police officer. Now, that is an occupation that I would not recommend to anyone - no matter what you do, it's the wrong thing. But back then police work was generally seen in a more positive light. And at least once a month someone would say "I couldn't do your job." Now, of course, everyone thinks they can if they watch enough TV.

Anyway, I will never forget one day, early on that I handled a call for some minor offense, I think it was misdemeanor shoplifting. I processed the guy, fingerprints & photograph, write up the report, statement of charges and all that and since he wasn't local his bond was set rather high to assure the court that he would appear later. (At least where I worked the police have no influence on the amount of bond.) He didn't have the money so off to jail we went. All through this we just chatted about everyday stuff, I remember fishing was one topic, but just normal guy chatter stuff. He had a record, he'd been through the drill before so nothing came as a surprise and he knew what to expect. He'd screwed up, he knew it, I knew he knew it, so there was no need to dwell on that. As that steel barred door slid shut (just like in the movies) he looks at me and says "Thank you."

A bit surprised, I said "I just took you to jail. What on earth are you thanking me for?" He said "You treated me decent. Nobody hardly ever does that."

Made my day. I'd made the world, at least for that guy on that day, a little bit better place. I didn't always succeed but I did try to do that every day.

Very well done!
I also would like to thank you, and thank you for sharing that story.

 

[RobbieB]

No matter where I worked I always did the least work required.

Once you have enough money, time is more important.

I quit a job where the boss insisted I work more. He kept trying to get me back after I left.

Nah, I do what I have to do, as much of what I want to do and as little of what other people want me to do.

If that ain't good enough, fire me.

 

[martyp]

I took a very traditional path. I went to college. Worked at the same place for 30 years. Retired with a pension. I was married (no kids). Owned a house. Lived within my means. Retired at 55. Five years into retirement and five years ago I made a big life change and got divorced and moved to Thailand. It is here that I first encountered people who took a different path. It is amazing how many people live cross border international lives. They have families in Thailand but work in their home countries traveling back and forth several times a year until they reach retirement age. They are responsible workers planning for the future but have taken a very different path.

There are, unsurprisingly, many young people here pursuing the path others have been describing. They are budget traveling through life and maybe surviving at low wage mostly teaching jobs. It all seems very precarious to me but I do respect the value of acquiring interesting life experiences. Living and traveling in foreign countries is a step up from living in at home in your 20’s & 30’s and surviving at dead end jobs.

 

[Mr._Graybeard]

I took a very traditional path. I went to college. Worked at the same place for 30 years. Retired with a pension. I was married (no kids). Owned a house. Lived within my means. Retired at 55. Five years into retirement and five years ago I made a big life change and got divorced and moved to Thailand. It is here that I first encountered people who took a different path. It is amazing how many people live cross border international lives. They have families in Thailand but work in their home countries traveling back and forth several times a year until they reach retirement age. They are responsible workers planning for the future but have taken a very different path.

There are, unsurprisingly, many young people here pursuing the path others have been describing. They are budget traveling through life and maybe surviving at low wage mostly teaching jobs. It all seems very precarious to me but I do respect the value of acquiring interesting life experiences. Living and traveling in foreign countries is a step up from living in at home in your 20’s & 30’s and surviving at dead end jobs.

Foreign workers are pretty common on Wisconsin's dairy farms, where job opportunities abound. Nobody is looking too closely for green cards. Work is hard, pay is low.

 

[jollystomper]

It has always intrigued me, how so many young people I know or families that just live life. They have no steady job or a career path in life. I see these young, clean living, adults with good health and great families and I always have a question how they do it.

I have some neighbors and a few good friends that their kids don't work but for an odd job here and there, or work in a pizza place etc. with no real future. They are great young people, always seem happy and accommodating when I'm around them or see them. I see nothing wrong with their life style, just isn't in my genes to not have a goal from very young and go get it attitude.

I'm not belittling these people or look at them any differently then anyone else, but not sure I would go through life living life like that. I'm talking kids in very late 30's to in their mid to late 40's.

The one thing that really sticks out to me is, that when they get up in age they will have very little resources. A continuous living with very little and harder to find that odd job to have a little extra.

I'm not sure if I feel bad for them but it would be a huge concern for me.

I think you have described the majority of people. Not that there is anything wrong with that. You have to remember that almost all of us on this forum are exceptions to the rule. Taking a long view, and planning things out, is different. We all took different paths to that exception. And I am not saying "exception" in a prideful way, just in a factual, unemotional, statistical way.

Also, even in our "exceptional" path, more than a few did not enjoy much of it. Look at how many retirement related threads include the thread creator lamenting on they need to retire because they are miserable in their chosen career and work. Many we perceive as not having a "steady' job look at that and say "why do you want to do something that is making you miserable?"

I never had strong goals and aspirations until I began to receive encouragement from others. The sayings "show me your friends and I'll show you your future" rings true. I am fortunate to have have parents, teachers and friends who encouraged me, even in my failures.

The biggest impact to having career was going and graduating from an Ivy League school. I remember being called into the high school guidance counselors office as a junior and being told by the lead college advisor that based on my GPA and PSAT score I should apply to Ivy League schools, and my initial reaction was "those schools are just for rich white people". When he heard the schools my assigned counselor was having me apply to, he got a look on his face and said "I'll handle your applications now". It took him a couple of weeks to convince me to apply.

What surprises me are the ones with what I perceive as a solid, lucrative career, who have way, way more than even I do, and are still very unhappy and insecure, and constantly feel they have to prove themselves (sometimes not by pulling themselves up but by pushing others down). I will never forget, at our college class 20th reunion, Classmate A going from happy on the first day to downright miserable the next day, after he found out that Classmate B, whom he thought he was smarter than when in school, was worth hundreds of millions. Classmate A was worth "only" tens of millions but you would have thought he was unhappily living in a van by the river by his mood and actions. I will take the "not perceived to have a steady career but happy" types over Classmate A any day of the week.

 

[yakers]

And then there are cases like DS, the subsistence musician. He went to college and got his music degree against my advice. but with my support as he was always serious & diligent about his music practice. This was painful to me, his NASA dad as he was really good at math & science. Amazingly AFAIK only 5% of those with a music degree get a job doing music. He has struggled and lived for 7 years after graduating in the same house from college days shared with other various students/struggling music/art/entertainment 'kids'. A couple years back his band did a week long road trip and after paying van rental, junk food costs and sleeping with friends and occasional cheap motel, they had all of $140 left. So I went to console him a bit and see that he is happy, really happy, seriously happy. Said it was so good he did not want to return. He works diligently ALL the time, gives lessons, plays in a Sunday church gig since it pays and doesn't conflict with band gigs. He plays weddings and anything he can get. He has a decent resume yet I know he only has medical coverage because of MediCal/medicaid. As a HS kid he was serious about music and would wake up and write music, stop along the road visiting his brother to write music. So I didn't want to squash his impulse but was hoping that he would channel his diligence into some better paying field. Now the good news, he has had a girl friend for 2+years and they plan to get married next year! And she is an intelligent, articulate attorney. Really grounded gal, told her dad to skip the wedding costs and make it a house deposit fund. They have survived COVID pandemic constraints, lived with her folks for 4 months, and Burning Man, I think this is going to work. As a trained musician in the LA area he can survive indefinitely, now the future is looking better from my (hopefully grandparent) perspective.

 

[MRG]

I remember as a kid being with my DM as she reviewed her aunt and uncle's monthly budget, wow. That said DW and I started our lives dirt poor, like not enough to eat. When we moved to KC at 21 for opportunities we had no flipping idea what that meant. But we d*mn sure were not going to admit defeat.. At 26 I started night school and got a job writing code. Sometime we stopped being hungry and started saving.

I feel bad for some of my nieces and nephews, their parents never figured out the saving part and their kids don't have an education or skills to do much.

 

[RetireeRobert]

And then there are cases like DS, the subsistence musician. He went to college and got his music degree against my advice. but with my support as he was always serious & diligent about his music practice.

Sounds like my youngest DD. Very serious about music, got her BFA in cello performance, her master's in cello performance, and a post-master's level Performance Certificate from Indiana U's Jacobs School of Music. Now back in Oregon, she is trying to piece together part-time temporary coffee barista job and part-time zoom cello teaching job for a school district into subsistence. She is still single, so often relies on Christmas or birthday "gifts" to make the rent money. But her hope is to get a paying salaried orchestra position, and she still has her dreams.

The oldest DD, also a musician, married a civil engineer, so oldest DD's gigs, as a church pianist, and as a community choral group's accompanist, provide spare fun money for them.

Fortunately for Dad, the retired CPA, my middle kid, my DS, has got a software developer position with state government making at the start more than what I made at the end! And has developed not only software, but also some serious investing and saving skills. I finally started referring my two daughters to him for advice on handling their IRA accounts!

 

[wrigley]

It has always intrigued me, how so many young people I know or families that just live life. They have no steady job or a career path in life. I see these young, clean living, adults with good health and great families and I always have a question how they do it.

I have some neighbors and a few good friends that their kids don't work but for an odd job here and there, or work in a pizza place etc. with no real future. They are great young people, always seem happy and accommodating when I'm around them or see them. I see nothing wrong with their life style, just isn't in my genes to not have a goal from very young and go get it attitude.

I'm not belittling these people or look at them any differently then anyone else, but not sure I would go through life living life like that. I'm talking kids in very late 30's to in their mid to late 40's.

The one thing that really sticks out to me is, that when they get up in age they will have very little resources. A continuous living with very little and harder to find that odd job to have a little extra.

I'm not sure if I feel bad for them but it would be a huge concern for me.

The world will always need "hamburger flippers", "convenience store clerks", and "baristas"!

 

[street]

I think you have described the majority of people. Not that there is anything wrong with that. You have to remember that almost all of us on this forum are exceptions to the rule. Taking a long view, and planning things out, is different. We all took different paths to that exception. And I am not saying "exception" in a prideful way, just in a factual, unemotional, statistical way.

Also, even in our "exceptional" path, more than a few did not enjoy much of it. Look at how many retirement related threads include the thread creator lamenting on they need to retire because they are miserable in their chosen career and work. Many we perceive as not having a "steady' job look at that and say "why do you want to do something that is making you miserable?"

I never had strong goals and aspirations until I began to receive encouragement from others. The sayings "show me your friends and I'll show you your future" rings true. I am fortunate to have have parents, teachers and friends who encouraged me, even in my failures.

The biggest impact to having career was going and graduating from an Ivy League school. I remember being called into the high school guidance counselors office as a junior and being told by the lead college advisor that based on my GPA and PSAT score I should apply to Ivy League schools, and my initial reaction was "those schools are just for rich white people". When he heard the schools my assigned counselor was having me apply to, he got a look on his face and said "I'll handle your applications now". It took him a couple of weeks to convince me to apply.

What surprises me are the ones with what I perceive as a solid, lucrative career, who have way, way more than even I do, and are still very unhappy and insecure, and constantly feel they have to prove themselves (sometimes not by pulling themselves up but by pushing others down). I will never forget, at our college class 20th reunion, Classmate A going from happy on the first day to downright miserable the next day, after he found out that Classmate B, whom he thought he was smarter than when in school, was worth hundreds of millions. Classmate A was worth "only" tens of millions but you would have thought he was unhappily living in a van by the river by his mood and actions. I will take the "not perceived to have a steady career but happy" types over Classmate A any day of the week.

That was very well said.
I guess I always thought and still do that most are in the same financial shape as we are but not the case. Happiness is key, no matter where we are ranked financially in life. My competitive nature wouldn't of been satisfied not shooting for the stars. Nothing wrong with not shooting for the star thou.

 

[street]

yakers >> what a great story and we all want the best for our children. It is natural to want them to be like us (the way we think) but they are not us, and have their own talents ambitions and we can't change that.

I DS and DIL a great future and a happy life together. It all works in time and we can get impatient in life.

 

[street]

The world will always need "hamburger flippers", "convenience store clerks", and "baristas"!

True!!!
I thank them all for doing those jobs. They are very important jobs that makes the world have continuity. I'm sure they are very happy people with their career.
One thing is those people are working and have a career. It is the ones that don't have the try/drive or a goal to see what the future will be like without job, no matter what the job is.