Mentally Ill /Dangerous People

[Elbata]

One thing I've learned as I get older is that it works best to be nice to everyone, even if they are being a complete jerk back to you. I try to never get angry with someone and never say anything mean or hurtful, even if I think they deserve it. It helps me keep my stress levels low, and it defuses the situation before it can escalate to something worse.

I'm not saying this will completely prevent a wacko from going after you, but it probably won't hurt.

I do like your philosophy. Maybe it's just me, but it does seem people are getting nicer and things don't bother me much. I must say though, sometimes it's a bit hard to hold my tongue

 

[marko]

I think there have always been unhinged people, but they do seem to show themselves more frequently

Not sure about other areas but around here they closed all the mental hospitals about 30 years ago and turned all kinds of dangerous people out onto the streets. There's no place to put dangerous people now until they hurt someone and then they go to prison.

Also there's lots of people on medications that keep them stable but oftentimes they stop taking them and then ....look out!.

 

[Redbugdave]

It takes two to tango. Most people do not seem to realize that they are in charge of their own anger as well as the way they think. Ego is a good part of the anger thing, too. I think most of the cases are caused by fanning the flames.

I always try to be aware of my surroundings when I am out. Even at stop lights, I always leave enough room to be able to maneuver and don't stop right alongside the other vehicle next to me.

In the past, I did work with some unhinged people. Working with people over time opens your eyes. Same with family members. Once something happens it is good to replay it in your mind and alter the methods you need to take when the next time happens. First time...shame on you, second time, shame on me.

My Three Stupid Rules:
1. Don't go to Stupid places.
2. Don't do Stupid things.
3. Don't hang with Stupid people.

 

[USGrant1962]

Not sure about other areas but around here they closed all the mental hospitals about 30 years ago and turned all kinds of dangerous people out onto the streets. There's no place to put dangerous people now until they hurt someone and then they go to prison.

Also there's lots of people on medications that keep them stable but oftentimes they stop taking them and then ....look out!.

There was a movement to “deinstitutionalize” the mentally ill starting in the 1970s. It is widely blamed for the homeless problem. A few of the front page violence incidents may have been stopped if involuntary commitment was still common. But there are also civil liberties problems with that.

 

[brewer12345]

I have a small canister of OC spray in the console of my car for such events.
Once, some years ago, I actually had to display it, which was enough to make the person back off. With luck, I'll never have to actually use it, but it's comforting to know it's there. You really don't want to be hit with that stuff.

Let's just say that this encounter would have ended very differently if I were the driver being accosted.

 

[Car-Guy]

I think there have always been unhinged people, but they do seem to show themselves more frequently in this day and age. As others mentioned, document your encounters and speak to the police to at least make them aware. As much as I would like to confront these bullies, that is the worst thing one can do, so avoid that at all costs.

+1 and, be prepared.

 

[redduck]

... I must say though, sometimes it's a bit hard to hold my tongue

You are not alone:

from Harvard Men's Health Watch:

"For most men, grip strength begins to decline around age 55. The change may be associated with sarcopenia—the natural age-related decline in muscle mass."

If interested, google something like "weak hand grip" and you will find a bunch of exercises to deal with your situation.

My guess is, in a few months time you will be able to hold your tongue for as long as you like.

 

[Helena]

It takes two to tango. Most people do not seem to realize that they are in charge of their own anger as well as the way they think. Ego is a good part of the anger thing, too. I think most of the cases are caused by fanning the flames.

I always try to be aware of my surroundings when I am out. Even at stop lights, I always leave enough room to be able to maneuver and don't stop right alongside the other vehicle next to me.

In the past, I did work with some unhinged people. Working with people over time opens your eyes. Same with family members. Once something happens it is good to replay it in your mind and alter the methods you need to take when the next time happens. First time...shame on you, second time, shame on me.


My Three Stupid Rules:
1. Don't go to Stupid places.
2. Don't do Stupid things.
3. Don't hang with Stupid people.

Good motto worth repeating !

To that I will add... don't stay out after midnight.

A policeman once said, there are three groups of people on the streets after midnight... cops, criminals and victims.

.

 

[MRG]

Let's just say that this encounter would have ended very differently if I were the driver being accosted.

I made an impulse buy of a used bond arms 3" .410. It's an O/U, not much good for grouse, but it has another use.

 

[marko]

I have a small canister of OC spray in the console of my car for such events.
Once, some years ago, I actually had to display it, which was enough to make the person back off. With luck, I'll never have to actually use it, but it's comforting to know it's there. You really don't want to be hit with that stuff.

I often thought of relocating my windshield squirters onto the roof of my car facing 90 degrees outward. Then filling the reservoir with something nasty in case someone came to my driver's side window....just a push of the button!

 

[marko]

There was a movement to “deinstitutionalize” the mentally ill starting in the 1970s. It is widely blamed for the homeless problem.

...and, sadly, many school shootings.

 

[brewer12345]

I made an impulse buy of a used bond arms 3" .410. It's an O/U, not much good for grouse, but it has another use.

My usual ride is a full sized pickup that is used for many things: towing, hauling, beekeeping (it is VERY nice not to have live bees in the car with you), hunting (down dirt roads, miles from nowhere), etc. We jokingly refer to it as the mobile command post, but truth to tell if I were stranded in the wilderness I don't imagine I would have much trouble making it a week or more with what is in the truck. Since there aren't many cubby holes in a truck cab, tools, knives, etc. are stashed wherever there is space. The nature of the beast is that there are several things that could conceivably be used as a weapon within easy reach of the driver's seat. Despite the temptation, I do not habitually leave a firearm in the truck due to fear of theft.

 

[joeea]

Sure is a lot of Hoplophobia in this thread.

I'm guessing the Hoplophiles were posting in a different thread.

 

[joeea]

The police typically have little if any legal ability to do squat until after the crime has been committed.

That is indeed the way the law works.

 

[haha]

Our city is turning into a dung heap because we have become experts at importing homeless and mentally ill people from all over the US. Recently some firefighter aid crews turned up a machete in one of the charming tent cities that now infest Pioneer Square. So now, any sort of call for aid needs 5 responders- 3 to give aid, and 2 for security.

Back in the day bums and troublemakers sleeping on the beach in LA often got a ride to the Greyhound terminal and a ticket to somewhere far away.

Some big convention business has been lost, maybe forever, because the downtown area is often unsafe, and always unattractive. Some moron politico said high pressure hoses should not be used to clean feces off downtown streets because this conjured up painful images of civil rights struggles from many years ago.

So unless you enjoy vacationing on poopy streets, perhaps best to stay away from Seattle vacations. If some crazy with a machete doesn't get you, disease could.

Ha

 

[ExFlyBoy5]

Many years ago, I had a very agitated driver try and confront me. He yelled and carried on, but eventually went back to his car after I refused to get out of my car or even converse with him. Luckily, it didn't escalate further because had he started attacking my vehicle, he would have been shot. It is very rare that I don't have a gun in the car with me as there are way too many crazy people out there and they often will come unglued for no reason at all.

 

[kcowan]

All this is why I chose not to have kids of my own. I do not want to bring more people into the world, to be subjected to the craziness that's all around us. Not worth it.s, despite the fact I like them - and would be a good parent if I had to...

Wow. Where do you live?

 

[candrew]

That may be true (I didn't look it up), but does it matter (from the standpoint of our own personal safety, it certainly matters to the mentally ill)?

From the standpoint of stereotyping the mentally ill as being more prone to committing acts of violence than the rest of society, yes it does matter.

But what if they are also 10x more likely to be a source of crime against the average population?

The mentally ill are not 10X more likely to be a source of crime. Making such a supposition is not helpful

Fact: The vast majority of people with mental health problems are no more likely to be violent than anyone else. Most people with mental illness are not violent and only 3%–5% of violent acts can be attributed to individuals living with a serious mental illness. In fact, people with severe mental illnesses are over 10 times more likely to be victims of violent crime than the general population. You probably know someone with a mental health problem and don't even realize it, because many people with mental health problems are highly active and productive members of our communities.

https://www.mentalhealth.gov/basics/mental-health-myths-facts

 

[travelover]

Fact: The vast majority of people with mental health problems are no more likely to be violent than anyone else........

I don't think anyone here seriously doubts this. The question for me is how to spot and deal with dangerous people regardless of whether they are deemed mentally ill.

 

[ERD50]

Fact: The vast majority of people with mental health problems are no more likely to be violent than anyone else. Most people with mental illness are not violent and only 3%–5% of violent acts can be attributed to individuals living with a serious mental illness. In fact, people with severe mental illnesses are over 10 times more likely to be victims of violent crime than the general population. You probably know someone with a mental health problem and don't even realize it, because many people with mental health problems are highly active and productive members of our communities.

https://www.mentalhealth.gov/basics/mental-health-myths-facts

You took my quote out of context, which I really don't appreciate. I said "for illustration,...", and it was a direct reply to the logic of your statement:

Originally Posted by candrew Statistically, people who are clinically mentally ill are far more likely to be victims of crime as opposed to perpetrators. ....

Logically, what you posted was irrelevant to the issue of the mentally ill and my personal safety. It was a Red Herring. And my response was not to prove or disprove anything, it was simply to point out that your statement wasn't meaningful to the context of our personal safety. You need other date/info for that.

There was no supposition on my part that the mentally ill are 10X more likely to be a source of crime, it was just a number picked out of thin air to illustrate how your logic was faulty.

I'll review your source on the additional info later, thanks.

-ERD50

 

[RunningBum]

Fact: The vast majority of people with mental health problems are no more likely to be violent than anyone else. Most people with mental illness are not violent and only 3%–5% of violent acts can be attributed to individuals living with a serious mental illness. In fact, people with severe mental illnesses are over 10 times more likely to be victims of violent crime than the general population. You probably know someone with a mental health problem and don't even realize it, because many people with mental health problems are highly active and productive members of our communities.

https://www.mentalhealth.gov/basics/mental-health-myths-facts

I think that's probably talking about the mentally ill as a whole, many of whom don't show signs of aggression. The OP was talking about very aggressive people, and whether they are mentally ill to the point of attacking people without regard for laws or whether it's just wrong.

I believe that 10x more likely to be victims is true, but that includes the street people you see talking to themselves, or just not able to take care of themselves, and aren't getting confrontational with others.

At least that's how I see it.

 

[Rianne]

Wait, wait, wait! IMHO do we even know what we're talking about here? First of all, what is mental Illness? I previously posted my uncle as an example of mental illness. People he knew in business, his mistresses and most who knew him socially would have been shocked that I suggested he was mentally ill. This man was a criminal and I won't even attempt to give examples. He fooled almost everyone who knew him.

Someone with OCD, who likes cleanliness and prefers perfection over sloppiness is considered mentally ill.

Folks who express their opinions loudly or protest an injustice are called "crazy."

People who become addicted to opioids because their doctor prescribed them with unlimited refills, then stopped refilling, who are on the streets trying to deal with addiction are mentally ill.

Depression is a mental illness. Has anyone on in this forum dealt with depression?

PTSD is a mental illness. These people have witnessed unspeakable acts or situations that impacted their lives more than most of us can imagine.

Children who've been pushed around, in and out of foster care who cannot figure out what a normal life is, yeah they're mentally unstable.

If the markets crashed or we lost everything to a crisis or a relative was kidnapped...the list goes on, I think I might tend towards mental illness. I'll probably get a porky on this but be real. No one is exempt from mental illness and it is so easy to criticize when life is good.

 

[Gumby]

Wait, wait, wait! IMHO do we even know what we're talking about here? First of all, what is mental Illness? I previously posted my uncle as an example of mental illness. People he knew in business, his mistresses and most who knew him socially would have been shocked that I suggested he was mentally ill. This man was a criminal and I won't even attempt to give examples. He fooled almost everyone who knew him.

Someone with OCD, who likes cleanliness and prefers perfection over sloppiness is considered mentally ill.

Folks who express their opinions loudly or protest an injustice are called "crazy."

People who become addicted to opioids because their doctor prescribed them with unlimited refills, then stopped refilling, who are on the streets trying to deal with addiction are mentally ill.

Depression is a mental illness. Has anyone on in this forum dealt with depression?

PTSD is a mental illness. These people have witnessed unspeakable acts or situations that impacted their lives more than most of us can imagine.

Children who've been pushed around, in and out of foster care who cannot figure out what a normal life is, yeah they're mentally unstable.

If the markets crashed or we lost everything to a crisis or a relative was kidnapped...the list goes on, I think I might tend towards mental illness. I'll probably get a porky on this but be real. No one is exempt from mental illness and it is so easy to criticize when life is good.

Good points, Rianne. It is easy and comforting to think that those who are deliberately and gratuitously violent toward others are mentally ill. Maybe some are, but many more are just plain evil. It is wrong to conflate the two, as it unfairly stigmatizes the mentally ill, while letting the evil ones off the hook.

 

[Lovely Linda]

Your comment about mental illness shows your ignorance and prejudice and contributes to stigma which then deters people from seeking help. I encourage you to learn more about mental illness and the myths such as yours.

 

[MichaelB]

Your comment about mental illness shows your ignorance and prejudice and contributes to stigma which then deters people from seeking help. I encourage you to learn more about mental illness and the myths such as yours.

Not sure which post you are responding to, the quote button is useful for that. You might also keep in mind we value civil interaction.