Electric Vehicles - Models Discussion

[GaryInCO]

Build quality and paint is much improved (build quality used to be appalling) but still not quite as good as most legacy automakers.

My Model Y, bought in mid-2022, was basically perfect as far as I could tell. I practically went over it with a magnifying glass (not really) and I couldn't find any paint or body defects.

Then I blew some dough to wrap the whole thing in PPF, so (if I can avoid major crackups) the paint will stay perfect.

 

[Midpack]

My Model Y, bought in mid-2022, was basically perfect as far as I could tell. I practically went over it with a magnifying glass (not really) and I couldn't find any paint or body defects.

Then I blew some dough to wrap the whole thing in PPF, so (if I can avoid major crackups) the paint will stay perfect.

I agree. I got my MYLR (Austin build) in Nov-2023, and I looked it over carefully on delivery, and even more so once I got home - and I haven't found any defects at all. I've driven it daily and hand washed it several times so I have looked it over completely. If there were paint defects, I'd have seen them drying the car by now.

They say Tesla paint is softer than most legacy automakers - although Japanese makes are known for thin and/or soft paint as well. I put PPF on the front only, and hand wash, that's as far as I am willing to 'baby' a car.

 

[Chuckanut]

A) Not all stations are opening to non-Tesla vehicles, so there may be zero additional traffic.
B) At most, even if every non-Tesla starts using Tesla superchargers, that is about a 50% increase in traffic. Yes, that is a large amount, but not unmanageable.

The local Tesla charging station near me has 12 chargers. It’s a rare day that I see more than three open and waiting for a car to drive up and connect. It’s not uncommon to see a line of 1-4 cars waiting, especially on the weekend. Since most EVs in my area are Teslas I can’t see that being a big impact, yet. But, if I was Tesla I would be watching that very closely. One of the smartest things Tesla did was build its charging network as it was selling the cars. That’s a huge advantage and I can’t imagine they want to lose it.

 

[Midpack]

The local Tesla charging station near me has 12 chargers. It’s a rare day that I see more than three open and waiting for a car to drive up and connect. It’s not uncommon to see a line of 1-4 cars waiting, especially on the weekend. Since move EVs in my area are Teslas I can’t see that being a big impact, yet. But, if I was Tesla I would be watching that very closely. One of the smartest things Tesla did was build its charging network as it was selling the cars. That’s a huge advantage and I can’t imagine they want to lose it.

I don’t doubt your experience at all, but it appears to be highly location dependent. I’ve only been to two supercharger locations so far, both 12 stalls, one had two cars charging, the other has ranged from 2 to 6. So no waiting at all. I have also driven by several other superchargers around NC and SC, before and after I bought a Tesla, and never seen any of them full.

Furthermore, you can see how many stalls are available (and pricing which varies by location) at any supercharger in real time. And they also project how busy any recommended superchargers will be when you arrive while on a longer road trip - before you arrive, and update as you get closer in real time. You can know beforehand, it’s not just show up and hope to get lucky.

 

[RetMD21]

The local Tesla charging station near me has 12 chargers. It’s a rare day that I see more than three open and waiting for a car to drive up and connect. It’s not uncommon to see a line of 1-4 cars waiting, especially on the weekend. Since move EVs in my area are Teslas I can’t see that being a big impact, yet. But, if I was Tesla I would be watching that very closely. One of the smartest things Tesla did was build its charging network as it was selling the cars. That’s a huge advantage and I can’t imagine they want to lose it.

Interesting. Sounds like a local problem. One of ten stalls is in use at the one closest to me which is typical. This link from last year indicates that there are 5 charging sessions/day/stall. https://insideevs.com/news/656779/tesla-charging-supercharging-stats/

 

[GaryInCO]

I’ve taken my MYLR on 5-6 multi-thousand-mile road trips, using 20-25 supercharger stations from Minnesota to Phoenix. I think I’ve seen someone waiting for a charger *once*.

I’m sure it’s a different experience in, say, California. But east of California, so far I haven’t had a problem.

The supercharger network was indeed a crucial component for Tesla‘s success, and it’s still an advantage. But they’re giving up that advantage to encourage the growth of EVs. It’s not charity — I’m sure they expect non-Tesla chargers to be a significant revenue source.

 

[audreyh1]

There are certain spots. San Antonio could be really bad on a weekend but they added several supercharger locations since. It’s extremely rare for me to wait on my long road trips and I get notified ahead if a given charger is busy.

The only time I ever had to wait my wait time was less than a minute even though there were two Teslas waiting ahead of me.

 

[ken830]

Opening the Superchargers to other manufacturer vehicles is bitter sweet. Tesla did a great thing for EV owners and EV adoption. It's a huge advantage that they are giving up basically for "free," but it does align with their mission and it is an important step to unlock the next phase of mass EV adoption, which is crucial to expand the market ahead of Tesla's next-generation vehicle platform currently in development.

 

[audreyh1]

I think it made them eligible for far more government subsidies supporting the US charging structure as well as preventing some other less desirable charging standard to take over. They pretty much had to do it.

Given their EV dominance I suspect they weren’t giving up that much. It’s still going to be tough for other US car manufacturers to beat them as well as build profitable EVs.

 

[Midpack]

The supercharger network was indeed a crucial component for Tesla‘s success, and it’s still an advantage. But they’re giving up that advantage to encourage the growth of EVs. It’s not charity — I’m sure they expect non-Tesla chargers to be a significant revenue source.

Opening the Superchargers to other manufacturer vehicles is bitter sweet. Tesla did a great thing for EV owners and EV adoption. It's a huge advantage that they are giving up basically for "free," but it does align with their mission and it is an important step to unlock the next phase of mass EV adoption, which is crucial to expand the market ahead of Tesla's next-generation vehicle platform currently in development.

Certainly an advantage Tesla needs to manage but remember:

• Tesla is not opening all their superchargers to other makes (so far).
• Other makes/models are being phased in slowly one by one, not all at once.
• There are more Teslas than all other EV makes/models in the US, so they’re not adding multiples of the existing Tesla population to their charging network. An earlier post suggested all US EVs would potentially add less than 50% to the network but…
• …don’t know if it will be universal (I hope it is), but non Teslas are being charged 30% more than Tesla owners at Tesla superchargers at some of the first ones to open to Ford (see post #1380). So “free” may not be accurate. The premium may slow non Tesla traffic and help pay (retroactively) for existing superchargers and future buildout.

 

[ken830]

I wrote "free" in quotes because for now, there is an option for non-tesla vehicles to get the same rate for energy as Tesla vehicles with a low-cost subscription.

 

[Koolau]

Consumer Reports just tested the range of 4 EVs. While it is no surprise that they all suffered range reduction in cold climate, some degraded more than others (down to 57% of EPA range).

On the other hand, some even exceeded their EPA range by a little when it was warm, despite the use of AC (80F and humid).

It would be interesting to see more EVs tested this way. It took CR a year to test in different weathers.

It turned out that the 4 tested EVs don't differ that much in their range in real life, despite their EPA advertised ranges. I like that, as it shows it's a competitive industry.

Reference for full text: https://www.consumerreports.org/car...e-affects-electric-vehicle-range-a4873569949/

I have not read this entire forum, so this may have been mentioned:


This month's (APRIL '24) Consumer Reports (Titled Best and Worst) has tested about a dozen models of EVs for range. The test was a 70mph run until battery exhausted. The thinking is that range anxiety is about long(er) distance travel rather than in-town or inter-urban travel.

Results ranged from a "worst" of 202 miles (Lexus RZ) to 380 miles for MB EQS. Anyone not taking CR can find it at the library.

The remainder of the report covers virtually all cars available these days with a short blurb and rating with tables of various types of cars compared. Kinda cool if you're into that sort of stuff - like I am, and I'm not even in the market.

CR seems definitely in the "hybrid camp" as being the sweet spot of overall car value for the money. Oh, and YMMV.

 

[Chuckanut]

I I am, and I'm not even in the market.

CR seems definitely in the "hybrid camp" as being the sweet spot of overall car value for the money. Oh, and YMMV.

Hybrids account for about 20% of new cars sold today, IIrC. The big problem is they aren’t being made fast enough to meet demand. One dealer in So Cal claims he has never had a Toyota Siena Van on the lot waiting to be sold since they were introduced over Four years ago. IOW, they are already sold before the dealer gets them.

 

[joesxm3]

Has anyone gotten Tesla FSD 12.3 yet? Or the one free month that they are giving out this week?

On X it said that every car capable of FSD will get a free month. I previously had subscribed and now seem to have 2024.8 version that is ahead of the FSD builds. So I have not gotten anything except two recent updates saying security fixes.

I am reluctant to subscribe and miss a free month. Also last time I had to pay for a month or two but did not get installed while waiting for the FSD build to reach the version I already had.

I would like to try 12.3 but I suppose 12.5 will be even better by the time I can get it.

 

[stephenson]

Sigh - I don't even like ios updates ...

Here's a Reddit thread ... I get it, but ...

https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/1bowgs5/fsd_beta_1232_rolls_out_teslas_visionbased/

 

[ken830]

Has anyone gotten Tesla FSD 12.3 yet? Or the one free month that they are giving out this week?

On X it said that every car capable of FSD will get a free month. I previously had subscribed and now seem to have 2024.8 version that is ahead of the FSD builds. So I have not gotten anything except two recent updates saying security fixes.

I am reluctant to subscribe and miss a free month. Also last time I had to pay for a month or two but did not get installed while waiting for the FSD build to reach the version I already had.

I would like to try 12.3 but I suppose 12.5 will be even better by the time I can get it.

I got it a couple weeks ago on the X and the 3. The X has since gotten 12.3.1. I haven't been able to try it in the X because it's my wife's daily driver and she doesn't like it when I use FSD with her and the kids in the car. I've used it a bit on my 3, but my commute through neighborhood streets is very limited, so not a lot of experience yet. The little bit I have seen, it drives very well. Only thing is the stupid NHTSA took away the rolling stop feature a couple years ago and the car acts very unnatural at stop signs as it comes to a complete stop and sits there for a second before moving. It annoys and confuses everyone around me. But this isn't unique to v12.

Just yesterday, FSD 12.3.2.1 was released on the 2024.x branch of FW, so that shouldn't be limiting your ability to get it.

 

[joesxm3]

Alas per notateslaapp it seems 2024.3 gets FSD but not my 2024.8.

 

[anothercog]

Prices on EVs are getting pretty compelling. I can lease a base Model Y for half the price of Camry. I already have a charger at home for PHEV and can charge for free at work. Tesla super charging station are ubiquitous in CA so I think I would be fine with the shorter 260 miles of range on the RWD version.

We’ll have another driver in our house later this year so we’ll need another car this summer and EV (probably a Model Y) will be it.

 

[audreyh1]

Alas per notateslaapp it seems 2024.3 gets FSD but not my 2024.8.

Yes, DH mentioned to me not to upgrade to 2024.8.

 

[Chuckanut]

Apparently Tesla hit the six million car mark today.

 

[Markola]

Has anyone gotten Tesla FSD 12.3 yet? Or the one free month that they are giving out this week?

On X it said that every car capable of FSD will get a free month. I previously had subscribed and now seem to have 2024.8 version that is ahead of the FSD builds. So I have not gotten anything except two recent updates saying security fixes.

I am reluctant to subscribe and miss a free month. Also last time I had to pay for a month or two but did not get installed while waiting for the FSD build to reach the version I already had.

I would like to try 12.3 but I suppose 12.5 will be even better by the time I can get it.

How much does the FSD cost/month? I’m Tesla-curious.

 

[audreyh1]

Rental had been something like $199 a month.

I had already been considering renting a month for an upcoming road trip. I’m really only interested in the enhanced autopilot features.

 

[joesxm3]

Changing lanes is nice on highway as long as it is not super crowded where it needs to be in the correct lane a mile early or else can't fight its way in.

For long trips in unfamiliar routes the navigate on autopilot is nice because it makes sure you don't miss an interchange because you were tired or unfamiliar.

 

[Midpack]

Rental had been something like $199 a month.

I had already been considering renting a month for an upcoming road trip. I’m really only interested in the enhanced autopilot features.

Every Tesla owner with an FSD capable Tesla (yours I’m sure) is getting a one month referral trial of the new V12 FSD beta with the latest software update. Mine started today thru 4/29, with 2024.3.6. So you can try it for a month free, don’t know if that coincides with your trip FWIW.

I thought V11 was amazing for the 3 months I had it last Nov thru Feb. Not perfect, but it performed very well 95% of the time including quite a few situations I expected it to falter, like properly driving through a construction zone to my amazement. More importantly when it was confused it never did anything unsafe - it mostly just hesitated longer than I was willing to wait (not fair make others cars nearby wait). I did let if figure out what to do when there were no other cars around a few times, and it did get it right usually. It made quite a few trips start to finish with NO interventions, city and highway.

Supposedly V12 is noticeably smoother and more human like behaviors, though still not perfect. You probably know V12 is completely new architecture, nothing like the 11 versions before.

 

[Koolau]

Hybrids account for about 20% of new cars sold today, IIrC. The big problem is they aren’t being made fast enough to meet demand. One dealer in So Cal claims he has never had a Toyota Siena Van on the lot waiting to be sold since they were introduced over Four years ago. IOW, they are already sold before the dealer gets them.

Heh, heh, sounds like one very happy dealer!


I think when (if) I ever replace my Rav 4 (standard ICE) I'll look for a used Prius or similar. YMMV